MINI Run Rules

[Monsta Mo Mini]

This was posted on M2 earlier.....
Anyone got any views they'd like to share?

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MINI Runs – Behaviour, Etiquette and What to Expect

The last few runs have seen some incidents that have resulted in damage to MINIs and personal injury too – though fortunately not of a very serious nature. We have also had MINI2ers leaving runs mid-way through because they felt intimidated by the pace of other drivers and there has since been much posting and discussion about this. Let's now try and move forward in a positive fashion, learn some lessons from the last few months to ensure future events result in everybody going home at the end of the day feeling happy, in one piece, and with their MINI in one piece too.

This thread is to be purely informational, i.e. no off topic banter or debates about whether somebody else’s post is a good idea or not. It can then serve as a point of reference for both organisers of Runs, to assist them in establishing a consistent and safe format, and attendees of Runs to help them to know what to expect and how to behave for the benefit of themselves and other runners.

Some ideas below have already been used or suggested by other MINI2 users – so thank you to all contributors and apologies for stealing them and not acknowledging all of you but a particular nod does go to DietCokePlease for extensive input

Organisers

Include a link to this thread in your Event thread to ensure attendees are aware of what to expect

Take time to prepare the route, research it on a map, drive it yourself, time it, change it, do it again – be aware organising will take its toll on your time.

Always provide pace notes for attendees to enable them to follow the route if separated from the main pack – try and make this available at least 2 weeks before the event to allow for people going away on holiday etc

Provide as much detail as possible on the pace notes, signage, landmarks etc

Wear a badge that clearly identifies you as an organiser so people know whom they can talk to if they need assistance on the day

Get someone who has not done the route to dry run the pace notes to check for errors – there will be some !

Organisers should aim to arrive at the meeting point at least 30 minutes before the start time.

Organisers of runs should aim to hold the start point within close proximity to a petrol station to ensure all runners can fill their tanks, especially important for those that have travelled a long distance to get to the start point

If the event is atteneded by large numbers split the runners into smaller groups. More than 30 cars in one group is impossible to keep together so aim for groups no bigger than this.

Expect people to get lost on the day – if you have a large number of runners it will always happen

Provide a mobile number for emergencies, such as those lost above

Get helpers – ask for volunteers to help on the day, have them in the middle of groups as well as the front and back to make sure people are not getting lost

Identify known hazards, such as fords, hump back bridges etc., on the pace notes

Vary the road conditions so there is variety for all types of drivers, slow twisties, faster open winding roads etc. However it is best to avoid the main “A” roads where possible as, due to traffic volume, this is where groups tend to get split up

Include mileage between each turn/change of direction on the pace notes. Show this for each section rather than as an accumulative total for the whole run, i.e. zero the trip counter between each stage

Provide frequent re-group points along the route so if someone is lost or the group gets split they can arrange to meet the rest again at the re-group point

Make it clear within the Run thread and pace notes that people are expected to drive courteously, legally and safely – persistent irresponsible behaviour will not be tolerated and offenders should be asked to leave the run

Accept people do drive at different speeds to you, both slower and faster, so allow for it

Expect bo

[Willie M]

I think we've covered most of these bases as the Scottish runs have evolved over the last year. Good set of guidelines though. Organistation and preparation goes a long way to ensuring a good day for all.

Yes sadly the last few MINI2 events have produced one or two 'incidents' :( This is certainly a concern as we don't want our little group to gain a reputation.

[minidriver#1]

still unsure as to why people feel the need to overtake. i found myself trying to keep those in front in sight and myself in sight of those behind. we're all going to the same destination so whats the point in speeding ahead. I think the guidelines suggested about cover pretty much everything i could think of anyways.

[AidenL]

Willy, you used wonder about Modding on M2..........The threads which prompted these guidelines have been the hottest, nastiest and most demanding I have seen in all my time.......dealing with double posts over the past two days would have been far more fun ! ;)

[Linda M]

I'm quite happy with deleting double posts now :clown:
Feel for you Aiden :)

[KenL]

I hate to think that people will put themselves and other road users at risk on a MINI run. I've only been on one so far (Borders) and really enjoyed it. It was quick at times but only when safe to do so and I never felt under any pressure to take risks.

As for people overtaking on runs that's just stoopid and rude. I think overtaking should be banned on runs, anyone doing so should be asked to go home or not invited to attend another.

On speeding, although everyone does it at some time or another, in order to preserve the good name of MINIs it is worthwhile always keeping within the speed limit on organised runs.

[KenL]

What were the incidents on the last few runs please?

[Tony]

i agree,...

I think by the very nature of what a run is all about,...spped limits should try and be stuck to. a train of MINIs is not very subtle,...and a train of speeding MINIs is only going to draw attention to itself.

Ive attended some classic car runs in the past, with my old cooper,..and those things were always SOO relaxed.

Ive got to admit,...at this moment in time,..even though Ive attended car runs in the past,..and ive taken part in competative road rallies, im dubious about taking part in MINI runs until things calm down. Maybe these 'incidents' will serve to remind all of us that things can go wrong.

i suppose my concerns come from maybe not KNOWING the people that i would be driving with in convoy. to this end, surely smaller runs, with people that are all familair with the others driving behaviours would go along way to regaining confidence in everyone going out together.

just my thoughts,....

[john]

I have not read all of this thread yet as I think it will take a bit of reading,BUT whats this about things calming down??

Yes there was an incedent on the Cullen run but it was caused by one driver and everyone else was stationery..

He came around the corner and did not expect us to be stopped(big mistake I know)but all said and done it could quite easily have been done by a Joe Bloggs who was not even on the run.


And yes the old mini runs are a lot slower, but then old minis are a lot slower,and I should know cos I still drive them.

So long as everyone continues to drive within their own limits and does not try to be better than they really are then what the problem.


Lets not spoil the runs by having more rules than the Road Traffic Act.




:)when is the next run anyway???????????????????

[Tony]

quote:So long as everyone continues to drive within their own limits and does not try to be better than they really are then what the problem.


John, i quite agree, but surely,..well for me anyway, this is in itself the dilema.

It appears that from other various threads which were kicking around MINI2, many people were/ are getting nervous and scared by other MINIers driving close to or maybe beyond? there own limits.

Im all for it. im bang up for a good thrash. its been a long time. but what you said sits at the heart of how i feel about ALL runs.

[Linda M]

In my opinion the thrill of a MINI run is a convoy of MINI's all together as the looks from passers by and other road users is just awesome :cool: However to have a convoy requires less speed and plenty of re-groups (this requires speed watching).

I also feel that a lot of the MINI drivers don't like the rules that have been laid down on the runs.

We all like to have a bit of a thrash in our MINIs from time to time but perhaps this should be left to us as individuals, not as part of a MINI run.

I do worry that people are beginning to view MINI runs as just a big thrash or a race.

It would be a real shame for our, or any other MINI group to be tarnished with a bad name.

[Big Col]

Hey Gordy, I dunno if we should try and attend the next run. Sounds like they're a bunch of hooligans on here. ;):D;):D;):D

[Big Gordy]

Yeh Col it all sounds a bit suspect to me ;):D The answer to this is to take it easy on the way to the run destination as a group and thrash the pants out of your Mini on the way home when the official adventure is theoretically over. :D

[Linda M]

You've got it Gordy, do what you want but NOT on a run and then the poor organiser can relax and enjoy it a bit :cool:

For us personally, the thought of organising another run at this point is very worrying which is a real shame cos Willie and I both enjoyed putting on a run for everyone.

The last thing we want to be doing is visiting a friend we've met through the MINI scene in hospital after a MINI run, think about it :question:

[Mini Martyn]

I think it should be more of a cruse than a run, windows down and tunes up!!

Oh and flags at full mast!

[AidenL]

Just back form the Cotswolds Run, bit of rain amazingly enough, but incident-free !:)

Knackered now though...........:(

[Monsta Mo Mini]

Bump!

[sleepyrascal]

If mini runs are all about getting a response from other road users and people in villages, then maybe we should have separate runs for 'show offs' and people who actually enjoy driving their car.:D;):D;)

[Julz]

I'm going with the 'time and a place' scenario! If you want to go out for a blast do it in your own time when you're less likely to put others at risk! It's your car, you can drive it every day of the year at whatever speed you want, but an NMS run only happens maybe once a month, enjoy yourselves but don't put yourselves and others at risk!:) I feel for Calum on the fact that this is his site, and anything we do on the road reflects on him, whether good or bad! If you want a wacky racers day out, keep it quiet, unpublicised and most of all, SAFE!!;):D

[ny152]

quote:Originally posted by sleepyrascal

If mini runs are all about getting a response from other road users and people in villages, then maybe we should have separate runs for 'show offs' and people who actually enjoy driving their car.:D;):D;)


Good idea Ewan - that would be a track day then!

Having been verbally assaulted by a BMW driver on an English run after a couple of mini's overtook him on a dangerous bend it aint much fun :blackeye:.

I much prefer a run where we go at an easy pace so we can see the scenery (which is often excellent) and allows us to see the smiles, waves, and the "was that a dozen MINIs?" looks from passers-by.

Most of us are probably guilty, me included, of driving over the speed limit some of the time. But to do it when in a convoy of other cars is just plain stupid.

[The Dogfather]

I think that these rules should be a sticky, please Mr/Mrs Mod! Knowing that these rules existed would have saved a lot of debate yesterday.

Calum/Julz are right we do need to slow down, and I'm just as guilty of driving over the limit some others. The wacky races could and should be done away from NMS runs. If your attending a run then it's your responsibility to stay within the rules, end of debate. This also applies to Runs to Runs as well.

Personnally I think the whole Convoy thing is the main problem and all runs with more than 12 MINIs should have a number of regroup points to allow the Convoy to break up allowing drivers to go at their own speeds and regroup later. Although I think there's still a place for the drive through towns convoys like at Braemar on the Cullen Run.

I'm not having a go at anyone, apart from myself, I'm just putting my thoughts down and this whole 'driving too fast' debate has taken the enjoyment out of organising yesterday's run. As a result I will be thinking 'long and hard' about the way my next run will be organised.

[Julz]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini

I think that these rules should be a sticky, please Mr/Mrs Mod! Knowing that these rules existed would have saved a lot of debate yesterday.


Unfortunately, I think it has been a sticky for a while!:(

[Wul]

Whilst the maps/directions are there to allow people to find the re-groups etc - when you don't have a co-pilot it's hard to read and drive at the same time! :eek: So that's why you keep the car in front and behind in view. On the run i organised it would have been all to easy to blast away down the roads I know like the back of my hand - unforunately the 20 others behind me didn't and the re-groups would take more time as the pack get's split up and people get lost.

Sorry to raise the incident again but the 2003 cullen run is a point in case - even with your pace notes are you reading 3-4 turns ahead? do you know about that give-way just over the blind right hander and the queue of minis waiting to turn - if someone belted into the back of my car trying to overtake me on a run i'd be very p'd off indeed!

Oh and watch out for admitting breaking the law on a public forum folks! :I

[The Dogfather]

Julz - Was it in the Run/Event thread, because this one isn't a sticky?

[MartinSullivan]

Its a sticky in Mini Meets and Social

[Scottch]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini

As a result I will be thinking 'long and hard' before organising another.


Now that's a real shame. Regardless of the discussion since, yesterdays run IMHO was excellent - but then, it was our first! :D

As the "newbie"(s), all I can say in our defence is that we weren't aware of the "run rules", and I know we certainly were not abiding by them :I

We'll know better next time though!

Cheers!

Scott

[Julz]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini

Julz - Was it in the Run/Event thread, because this one isn't a sticky?


Oh yes it is!!!:p

[The Dogfather]

quote:Originally posted by MartinSullivan

Its a sticky in Mini Meets and Social


It wasn't this morning! I smell the work of a sneeky mod ;)

[MartinSullivan]

I thought it had been a sticky for a while but you might be right BDM :D.

I hope that you dont let peoples comments put you off organising events - you cant please all the people all of the time. You have put a lot of time and effort into organising events and you should be appreciated for that, but we need to tailor events to suit everyone as much as possible.

[The Dogfather]

quote:Originally posted by Scottch


quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini

As a result I will be thinking 'long and hard' before organising another.


Now that's a real shame. Regardless of the discussion since, yesterdays run IMHO was excellent - but then, it was our first! :D


Scott - That statement came across wrong, I've editted the post to put my point across better. I'm not taking my ball away in a sulk, rather taking more time to think about how the next one will be put together to make sure there's no repeat of yesterday's issues. Rome wasn't built in a day!

[Julz]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini

It wasn't this morning! I smell the work of a sneeky mod ;)


Always jumps to conclusions eh!!:evil: If you'll bother to look at the first post of today, it was Calum, owner and guru of this site!!:clown:

[The Dogfather]

I just said sneeky mod, that could be anyone of you :p If I'd said stroppy then you'd be right :evil:

By the way this post was started after the Cullen 2003 Run, I know I'm like a piece of the furniture but Arbroath was my first Run, sweetie ;)

[The Dogfather]

Edit Julz :eek:? Too late spotted it!

[duncan]

quote:Originally posted by Julz

I'm going with the 'time and a place' scenario! If you want to go out for a blast do it in your own time when you're less likely to put others at risk! It's your car, you can drive it every day of the year at whatever speed you want, but an NMS run only happens maybe once a month, enjoy yourselves but don't put yourselves and others at risk!:) I feel for Calum on the fact that this is his site, and anything we do on the road reflects on him, whether good or bad! If you want a wacky racers day out, keep it quiet, unpublicised and most of all, SAFE!!;):D




Got to agree with you their Julz.
The speed issue has been around since we were just a gathering on Mini2.

As Calum is the site owner, and cars are displaying the web address on the back, I think he could end up, unfairly, with grief from someone’s behaviour.

You've got to think about that, and the good history that the site has had over the last few years.

[Julz]

Fair do's, I realised that it was after 2003, I just thought it was this years seeing as it seems so familiar!

As for the sneeky and stroppy comment, considering I'm the only mod to have been on this thread since Calum this morning, I think it was pretty obvious you were having a dig at me!!:evil:

[MartinSullivan]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini
I know I'm like a piece of the furniture ....

You aint that wooden mate ;)

[Big Col]

quote:Originally posted by Julz

As for the sneeky and stroppy comment, considering I'm the only mod to have been on this thread since Calum this morning, I think it was pretty obvious you were having another dig at me!!:evil:


I don't have mod powers otherwise I'd have edited your post to the above ickle one. :)

[The Dogfather]

I was :D just pointing out that I wasn't talking out of my bottom (for a change) about this not being a sticky.

I didn't know about these rules prior to organising runs but now I do I will factor these in to any future runs. Yesterday was my 3rd run (Chip Butty and Blackpool before) this was the first time one of my runs had this problem. Although, as others will know it was something that was on my mind prior to yesterday.

I would also like to point out that although Calum hosts, started and maintains the site we are all accountable for our own actions, and as a community we should be self policeing which is effectively what is happening here!

[Julz]

I'm also fairly sure if you use the standard NMS header for run notes, the general basis is on them! I'm fairly sure this thread was or has been a sticky for quite a while, but only Calum can answer this to confirm whether or not HE made this a sticky! :clown:

[The Dogfather]

NMS Run Header? Christ! ;) How many more things are hidden away on here? :D

[Julz]

Nothing is hidden! It's a standard sheet 'most' people have used or got Calum to do for them when organising a run!

[The Dogfather]

Julz - I didn't mean it's been hidden, just that there's a lot of content on the site that isn't obvious because it's fallen down the list. As for the 'most' the sheet wasn't used on any recent runs I've been on. (Maybe Cullen but I took that as a special case)

[duncan]

Certainly used for the recent Harvest and Three Lothians.

Perhaps if there are quite a few newbies on the run, its not obvious to them.

[Julz]

They've certainly been used on near enough every single run I've been on!!:clown:

[The Dogfather]

:mad::disapprove:
[color=red]Wasn't able to attend either the Harvest or 3 Lothian Runs but having had a look at the notes neither contain the detailed rules set out by Calum.

And it's hardly fair to expect someone to know about a standard sheet if they've never organised a run before and they've never been on a series of runs were sheets like this have been used.

<At this point I launched in a tirade which was unfair on Julz, I have since edited that post as not to cause offence, this will all make sense when you read on :D>

Apologies Julz.

[The Dogfather]

The sheet wasn't used on either the Aberdeen Runs, Blackpool Run, Abroath, Loch Ness, West Coast as far as I can make out or Central runs. Rob did do a sheet but I think this was of his own design.

[Big Col]

Whoa! Steady on thar boss man! I was going to post saying it always was a sticky but didn't want to wade in. I don't think Julz would change it at 10:30 just because she didn't want to admit she was wrong. It's not her style. You also do dig people up all the time so J got a lil bit defensive. Remember smilies don't always cover it.

If you have a complaint about the mods you should email them directly or go to Calum, not have a rant at her in front of everyone!!!

[duncan]

NMS, and the run sheets, have been around LONG before those events................

[Big Col]

Does it really matter??? It's only a run sheet. NMS has always beena friendly site where people avoid bickering seriously in public. Let's keep it that way:question:

[The Dogfather]

Col - You're right I shouldn't make it public and have edited the post. Plus it was a bit harsh on Julz.

Apologies if you read it Mrs Mod.

[duncan]

quote:Originally posted by Big Col
Does it really matter??? It's only a run sheet. NMS has always beena friendly site where people avoid bickering seriously in public. Let's keep it that way:question:


Depends on your point of view.

[The Dogfather]

Duncan - Quite right Long before being the point I was making, I only joined NMS in June and have never seen these used regularly.

[Julz]

So maybe you should take a step back and think before sticking your oar in eh!!;) As you said yourself, you've only been here a matter of months and are obviously unaware of the way some things have become a tradition to carry out, having a personal vendetta against me is all fine and well keeping it off of public forums would be appreciated though, but please remember, some of us have been here years, not months and can, sometimes, be right!;):D

[The Dogfather]

I was about to apologise for being outspoken and going on a rant, but the we were here first attitude really stinks!

[CooperTrooper]

just my tuppence worth . . .

this site can be very 'cliquey' (right spelling? right word?)so the 'we were here first' doesnt suprise me.

just an observation! also, i havent been on any runs yet, cos i can see me gettin carried away, n goin too quick. . . .

[Julz]

It's nowt to do with 'we were here first' it's more 'this is how we've done it for ages and it seems to work'!

[The Dogfather]

Yes, but you do have to tell people how you do it or how are we going to know?

[The Dogfather]

I'm not disputing the fact these rules/sheets exist just pointing out that unless you make them prominent new people won't know.

And Julz I never have nor ever will have a personnal vendetta, I feel very strongly about the comments I removed and will forward them to both you and Calum for comment.

[Julz]

It's mainly because usually the people who organise a run have already been on a few and it just seems par for the course! Either that, or they generally ask what procedures are usually followed when organising a run!:clown:

[The Dogfather]

Par for the course, tradition etc - hardly encourages the new blood to come along and join in or organise a run themselves.

A lot of runs are down on the central belt and its a long day to travel all the way down from the far NE, so we need people up here to organise runs, this idea that you have to attend runs or ask for advice isn't going to help that.

What's next Newmininortheastscotland.co.uk? Newminiglasgow.co.uk? Now that would be a shame!

Cooper sorry if you feel the sites a bit cliquey, I wonder how many others feel the same?

[Big Col]

Geez. No one was right in this instance. Everyone that has organised a run before could have said to BDM the sheet was there. BDM you could've asked "How do you normally organise a run" and people would have been more than happy to help. Neither side is right and neither is wrong.

I've also never found the site cliquey (your spelling was right coopertrooper ;)) but then again I suppose I might be part of the clique and not know it.

Now I'd just like to say "Gerrit up ye all I think you're all wrong" so I can keep the resident heckler status. :)

[Julz]

I'll 2nd Cols comment, but he can type faster than me cause I've got this stupid bloomin' splint on my arm!!:p

[Wul]

Time out here folks - if you refer to the first post on this thread I think you'll find it makes no mention that these rules are mandatory to all NMS runs - but it does ask for comments and opinions on the rules from MINI2 runs.

From there they have been abbreviated somewhat and included on the top of the run notes on Cullen, Harvest runs. For the 3 lothians run I used the ones from Julz/John and changed them again to suit the time of year/roads/day of the week accordingly.

It's not essential to have these rules - as at the end of the day they will put some people off - but they are there to help.

It's great that new members organise runs and long may it continue as the more runs there are the more chances people have of hurling abuse at me for not attending them;):D

[Wul]

as for the site being cliquey - I suppose when people get friendly with each other:I then that is inevitable - but then the newbies can join the clique simply by posting on the threads. I'd much rather be part of a smaller clique on here than a no-body on MINI2 listening to the same questions being asked time after time :eek:

[duncan]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini

Par for the course, tradition etc - hardly encourages the new blood to come along and join in or organise a run themselves.


No one expects someone who has just joined to organise a run!
You took that step off your own back, and if you didnt seek advise or look back and see how other runs have gone, thats up to you.

If the club had a formal structure, you wouldnt expect someone who has just joined to take over a committee post?

If you seriously didnt like what has gone on "in the past" I wouldnt expect new members, but perhaps because it has been appreciated, there have been a lot of members joining.

Groups evolve, but good practise stays.


quote:
A lot of runs are down on the central belt and its a long day to travel all the way down from the far NE, so we need people up here to organise runs, this idea that you have to attend runs or ask for advice isn't going to help that.


If thats where someone chooses to organise a run, then thats up to them. Its not the law to attend them all.
I have other commitments and can only attend the ones I can.

Its good that they take place all over Scotland, but seeing as the majority of the members stay within an hour of the central area, its understandable that they take place there.


quote:
What's next Newmininortheastscotland.co.uk?


The way some of the threads go, you would think that this has already happened.


quote:
Now that would be a shame!

Agreed.

[Julz]

quote:Originally posted by Wul
the more chances people have of hurling abuse at me for not attending them;):D


Not possible I'm afraid!!:p

[duncan]

quote:Originally posted by Julz


quote:Originally posted by Wul
the more chances people have of hurling abuse at me for not attending them;):D


Not possible I'm afraid!!:p


Watch out - thats traditional :blackeye::p;)

[Gismo]

This topic always makes for interesting reading whether on here, MINI2 or any motoring related site, you should see what the Scooby drivers get up to.
Anyway, I would like to reiterate that there is no intentional clique within NMS, yes, folks who have been around for a long time will gather in little groups and natter like little old hens, this is realism and happens in all walks of life, but, at no time has anyone ever complained of not being made welcome at any of the runs I have attended nor indeed has it been posted. If it has then please bring it to my attention to prove me wrong.
I sat with Steph (only name I’m gonna use in this post) who was on her first run and didn’t complain of being left out, had I been able to stay longer she would have benefited from my ability to finish off her lunch.
Onto the run itself, many times people jump onto the band wagon of you should do this or that when we are all as guilty as the next person, yes I like a good keen spirited run, in this instance I moved over to let others through as I didn’t want to “spoil” their drive.
If anyone feels that they will not attend due to others excessive speed then we have lost the spirit of the event, especially if some feel that way having never attended a run, maybe they would like to show the rest of us how it should be done
As for the rules, they are guidelines, all geared towards everyone having a good time whilst abiding by the law, if we overstep that mark then we must suffer the consequences.
We are all responsible for our actions and do indeed represent NMS when out and about having organised it through the site.

Lately there has been much sniping and tit for tat posting, mostly in fun but often giving me the impression of a bit too close to the bone.

Some feel that even though they post and have a point that they are right, well you only have to see the sense of removed posts to see common sense prevailing.

I’m afraid that simply saying that because I didn’t know there were guidelines so how do we know what to do ain’t good enough an excuse, it’s easy to ask for assistance.

Lately there have been many more runs organised which is great, only downside for me is, I can’t get to them all, as NMS grows there will be many more and long may that continue, so, a plea to any future organisers, make it abundantly clear that your particular run is with a view to take in the scenery, keeping close tabs on folk in front and behind and I’m sure we’ll all enjoy ourselves

[The Dogfather]

I've organised 2 previous runs without advice/guidelines all without any problems. Only the run yesterday seemed to be a problem.

And it wasn't even a bit of the Run I was on!

Regarding the site how about some new mods (not to replace but in addition) to show the fact the NMS isn't just about the old guard. I'm not saying me - too hot headed

[Julz]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini

Only the run yesterday seemed to be a problem.


I don't think it was your run persoanlly, there seems to be this wee quibble every now and again, so donn't take it to heart, and certainly don't let it put you off organising another! I've been on both of your runs of late and have enjoyed them both without having any problems with speeds etc!:clown::D;)

[MartinSullivan]

As Julz says its something that comes up every now and then - but it should be taken into consideration everytime a run is put together.

[Burple]

quote:Originally posted by Big Col
Geez. No one was right in this instance. Everyone that has organised a run before could have said to BDM the sheet was there. BDM you could've asked "How do you normally organise a run" and people would have been more than happy to help. Neither side is right and neither is wrong.

I've also never found the site cliquey (your spelling was right coopertrooper ;)) but then again I suppose I might be part of the clique and not know it.

Now I'd just like to say "Gerrit up ye all I think you're all wrong" so I can keep the resident heckler status. :)


Bleedin' 'eck..
Right folks... get your cameras out...
Col... I agree totally! (<phew> there...that was easy!)


Folks... time to take a step back and a have a look.
We all do this for the fun and pleasure of it all. Nobody wants to be a spoilsport and ruin anyone else's enjoyment or runs, but on the other hand there is the safety of all (cars and people) to think about. Not least there's the reputation of the Owner and Bloke wot started the site to think about. (p.s... Good job Calum!)
Yes, it can appear a bit Cliquey, but no-one EVER gets excluded. Of all the people I've met through various Classic Mini clubs through the last few years, I can honestly say that I've never met such a large diverse FRIENDLY bunch of people anywhere. Ok, so some people have been here longer (and I know a lot have been here longer than me!) but no one will intentionally ignore you.
Generally, it's the people who have been around the longest who have organised the runs, but no-one is intentionally discouraged from having a go. The rules have been there for a while now for comment and discussion after the previously discussed 'incidents'.

We all do this for fun in our spare time, and I'd like to continue that way.
After other events that unfolded over the weekend for me, the run was a welcome chance to get out for a good run, and catch up and have a bit of a giggle, and it certainly cheered me up!

After being on the Cullen run last year and seeing the effects of the incident, it's always at the back of my mind on runs now (if not any time I'm out in the car!), and I wouldn't like to see anyone else I know involved in anything similar in the future - and certainly not myself!

Take a step back kids and look at the big picture! Be sensible so we can keep enjoying these events! :):cool:

Right.. back to Off Topic and Banter for me! :D:D:D:D
<Clambers down off of soap box>




edited cos I cannae spell today;)

[Julz]

I'd just like to state that LnL's post was written by his mum, cause there's no way he could write anything that sensible, let alone manage to clamber onto the soap box (his mum had a ladder!!);):D

[Big Col]

I don't think he wrote it because he agrees with me! :eek:

[The Dogfather]

Basically me and Julz had an arguement in public, which should have been had offline. Is it possible to go back in time and start again?

I bet that's Flick using LnL account!

[Scottch]

quote:Originally posted by bad dog mini
I bet that's Flick using LnL account!


Yep it is ;)

He told me so just now on MSN that Flick was writing his well thought up and concise reply :D

Cheers!

Scott

[Kirsty]

Although bits of yesterday were a wee bitty fast I did really enjoy the run!!:) I do agree with keeping people in front and behind in view, cos as most of you know I tend to go off on my own for a wee drive if I'm not looked after!! HEE HEE!!! (Cullen 2004):I I have to say that I have been a member of NMS for A WHOLE YEAR now, with my first run being my nasty green astra event!! :mad:(and at 5mph on the slippery bend, speed can't be blamed for that one!!) I have always felt that EVERYONE was really friendly, yeah there are those that have known each other for years and will chat away like old grannies (no offence meant HEE HEE) but never once have I felt left out of that!!:D The runs are always really well organised and this was the first run that I've been on that didnt have the "rules" at the top of the page!! (or condensed version, whatever you want to call it) I really hope that the runs can continue to be a bit of light relief and fun for everyone and not turn into a war zone!!:( I have to say if I was new to the site, the posts on this thread would have seriously put me off joining any runs!!:( We are all a nice, sensible (at times) bunch of people, who love our minis, love socialising and love eating!! SOOOOO when is the next run and we'll show em how it's done!!?? :p:):D

[Burple]

Right youse three!
OT&B Fight thread! Right Here! (http://www.newminiscotland.co.uk/snitzforums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3354) NOW!!!

There's backs of knees to be slapped! :blackeye::p

[weefozzy Jr]

This is a difficult topic and as a newish member want to stay out the issue's of speed, although i dont think the fast cars in the group should bee blamed as the roads we mostly use in mini runs are twisty making all the cars even due to handling(dam i think got involved a little). on the topic of feeling welcome or there is a cliquey this should just be dropped. its bull****, and you can have a go at me as a uni student have plenty of time to reply. as one of the youngest members all i can say is that i have felt welcome from day one,(even before i had a mini).now i have a mini, although u dont like the music your all still as funny and nice as ever. calum has recruted a great bunch of people and got a great club started.

[X30YES]

Have to say this is getting a wee bit OTT re speed, Over two hrs to do 80 miles from Stirling to Blair Athol ...is that fast ?...and on fleein through built up areas that NEVER happened in the front group ,not once .As I said before its the driver that controls the speed ,and as good route plans are always handed out prior to 'the off' getting lost is not a problem .
I also did a bit of Rallying in my youth and always do my own route checks before I go on any run with the OS maps and make a set of pace notes over and above the route directions handed out ,perhaps this would be a good idea for others to look at a map before they go on any run, at least that way they will know where they are going ...I don't see the need to catch the car in front if you feel you are being left behind due to traffic lights in towns ,road works or other road users . Ample stops/rest halts are always made to pick up back markers .....as I'm sure most will agree,and on a number of runs I have waited for some backmarkers to catch up so they dont feel lost or out of it
The pecking order will always arise during a run and perhaps if you feel the need to be up front be there .....and if you want to go at your own pace, as a number of people do, so be it .This is not an easy subject to discuss without someone feeling that they are having the finger pointed at them, and my comments are not directed at anyone in particular .The thing is that I dont remember seeing any silly overtaking or dangerous driving so I can't comment on that , all I can say is 'You can only please some of the people some of the time ,and can't please all the people all the time '.This is a very well run and organised mini advenrure with happy,welcoming people running it ,LETS KEEP IT THAT WAY ,and take the good points as well as the bad ones on board and build on it without any of the bickering stuff that was going on in Mini2,when I was there in mid 2001 ...........is that another can of worms just been opened ..I hope not .
Is a split group the answer on a run ?...perhaps .

[sleepyrascal]

quote:Originally posted by X30YES

Is a split group the answer on a run ?...perhaps .


I suggested something similar.

As a new member (since June 03 I think) I have never found anybody to be cliquey. Friendly more like!

[Scottie]

I joined the club early 2004.

Never felt unwelcomed and enjoy meeting other like minded folk.
Yesterday was a good day and it was good to see Juls'z mini we should have parked next to each other.

I like to have a bit of banter with old codjers in pink pringles:p:D

You know who you are:evil:

[sh@z]

i can honestly the NMS bunch is one the most welcoming and friendliest group of folk i have ever met... well for the most part hehe :)

But seriously i dont get where someone would feel it's cliquey (Spelling?) a lot of ppl are good friends thanks to this site and as you would imagine they tend to stick together... as i do with some folk.... but they are never unwelcoming to others no matter new members or old school....

Anyways seems this whole thing got a tad out of hand and glad to see some order restored

[Julz]

quote:Originally posted by ScottieCoop
Never felt unwelcomed and enjoy meeting other like minded folk.
Yesterday was a good day and it was good to see Juls'z mini we should have parked next to each other.
:evil:


That's what I said to Rob (I let him drive) but by the time he paid attention to what I said, we were past you!! Sorry we didn't get the chance to speak yesterday, so many new faces to try and get round, plus I wanted to see under that bonnet!!:p:D

[Scottie]

quote:Originally posted by Julz


quote:Originally posted by ScottieCoop
Never felt unwelcomed and enjoy meeting other like minded folk.
Yesterday was a good day and it was good to see Juls'z mini we should have parked next to each other.
:evil:


That's what I said to Rob (I let him drive) but by the time he paid attention to what I said, we were past you!! Sorry we didn't get the chance to speak yesterday, so many new faces to try and get round, plus I wanted to see under that bonnet!!:p:D


That's alright you will see under the bonett when were parking the caravan in your garden for the cullen 2005 run:D:p

[Steph]

quote:Originally posted by Bonnie Scotland

'... at no time has anyone ever complained of not being made welcome at any of the runs I have attended nor indeed has it been posted. If it has then please bring it to my attention to prove me wrong.
I sat with Steph (only name I’m gonna use in this post) who was on her first run and didn’t complain of being left out, had I been able to stay longer she would have benefited from my ability to finish off her lunch...'


Alan, I could really have done with your eating ability - I had to leave half the mince, it was too much for me! I did not feel left out - just made sure I sat with some trustworthy looking people, instinctively knowing they'd look after me:D

And out in the car park, I just plaintively mentioned my tyre pressure warning and help was instantly given8).

[MartinSullivan]

quote:Originally posted by Steph
I did not feel left out - just made sure I sat with some trustworthy looking people, instinctively knowing they'd look after me:D



There must have been a coach party in was there:question::question: ;)

[ELFMAN]

Glad this thread has calmed down a bit! The best thing about NMS is the friendly atmosphere, and I'd hate that to be diminished by folks having a go at each other - when people argue and others "take sides" the club is finished.

The topic of speed has been raised before. We were in the "lead group" (fourth of four cars) coming out of Callander, and the pace worked up to what I reckoned was about as fast as you could safely go (and once or twice faster) in the road conditions. It was fun, but I must admit to feeling slightly nervous at times, and eventually we backed off a bit. We had by then dropped the following group(s), who caught up a bit down the road.

If you point a great car at a good road, it's almost inevitable that speeds will pick up, but keeping a lid on it is the main thing. I was also a bit concerned that once we've overtaken other road users, we then slow down, and eventually end up passing some vehicles TWICE - which could (understandably) p*$$ other road users off. The last thing we want is a wee Police road block at the next village pulling us over because someone's phoned ahead. What might seem to us a harmless overtake might well scare the crap out of an unsuspecting Sunday Driver, then repeat that six or seven times.... On these roads, there are concealed entrances, Cyclists, Horses and even pedestrians and lots of mud and leaves.....

I enjoy a quick blast as much as the next person - even if the next person is Colin McRae - been doing it since I had my first Mini twenty-odd years ago. It's why I got into new MINIS in 2001 and there's great satisfaction in wringing the thing out, putting together a series of bends, or getting that downchange just right with the exhaust popping and banging.... But I also really enjoy cruising with the other MINIS, there's a sense of camaraderie when we arrive somewhere and folks get a real buzz seeing so many FAB cars together, and it's more relaxing too! It's all about "balance" and common sense. Despite the high speeds etc at times on Sunday, I didn't see anybody doing anything genuinely stupid. There were a nice couple of moments when people out walking (Kinloch Rannoch upwards) gave us a cheery wave and big smiles - we were at the back of the convoy which told me that all the previous cars had been careful and courteous to the folks on foot - nice one.

I reckon there's a "happy medium" (Mystic Meg?) here between 'Tarmac Special Stage' and 'Cruise'. If we can back off the speed a wee bit (difficult I know), folks can still enjoy the performance of their cars, but not leave others miles behind and feeling that they've got to keep up or be left out. It would also give a bigger safety margin and possibly prevent upsetting non-MINIS en-route.

I definitely DON'T think the run should be "split" into those who want to go tear-arsing up the road and those who want to just cruise. I mean, what the hell speeds would the "fast group" get up to then? The very fact of establishing a "performance-based" sub-group is asking for trouble ("Anything you can do" etc - we ALL have EGOS!). We're a Club and we should come to an accomodation to suit the majority, not sub-divide. Variety is what keeps us interesting and interested as a group, Families, Pals, Folks on their own, fast ones, slow ones, old(er) ones, Young Ones ("Shut UP Neil, you sad Hippy!" screamed Rick).

One thing I (as a potential Old Fart) would like to see knocked on the head is the practice of weaving about onto the wrong side of the road and back again - OK, it's a "laugh" (Hmmmmm....) and (usually) on a straight bit of road, but in my rear view mirror yesterday there were a couple of MINIs which seemed to be playing "Tig" all over the road. All it needs is something to nip out from a side road onto what they think is "their" clear side of the road, and the sh*t will hit the fan (and the bulkhead). It's also distracting for those of us who don't want to do it, not to mention any oncoming traffic in the distance..... There's driving and there's playing. Don't play on the road.

Whatever our

[Scottie]

quote:Originally posted by ELFMAN
One thing I (as a potential Old Fart) would like to see knocked on the head is the practice of weaving about onto the wrong side of the road and back again - OK, it's a "laugh" (Hmmmmm....) and (usually) on a straight bit of road, but in my rear view mirror yesterday there were a couple of MINIs which seemed to be playing "Tig" all over the road.



I've noticed people doing that. Thought they were trying to heat their tyres up :p:D;) Like in F1:blackeye::p:D

[ELFMAN]

Yes, it's F1-ing silly!

[Kirsty]

<sneaks in quietly> Sorry!! <runs away again an hides>

[Sheilz]

quote:Originally posted by Kirsty

<sneaks in quietly> Sorry!! <runs away again an hides>



Its ok Kirsty, coz i was behind you and can vouch that youe weren't endangering anyone else and besides Ronnie(?)F1-ing made Nik grin from lug to lug.;):D:D:D

[Kirsty]

Thank you!! It is a wee bit silly tho I agree!! :I I'll maybe stick to flying in future (if I have a passenger) a bit safer and at least its only a bloody (blood covered not swearing honest) arm hitting the cars windscreen behind if were not careful!! HEE HEE!!! Nik will like the flying one better!! :D

[ELFMAN]

Knew it would come across as old and farty....:mad:

Like I said in the main entry, I didn't see anybody doing anything "genuinely stupid" (or "endangering" anyone). But it's a fact when people start mucking around on the road - be it 'zig-zagging' or whatever - the "mind-set" changes and it's all too easy to forget where you are and what you're doing. I've been involved in clubs and runs for years - I've seen it happen - I've done it myself!

When you're driving, you should be concentrating totally on the road 8), if you're playing around, you're not. It's a laugh till someone gets it wrong, or something unexpected happens. I found it disconcerting at the time. For example, what if I'd had to do an emergency stop? Second or so delay for the following cars to notice....how far do you travel @ 40+mph in a second? BANG!:eek: :blackeye: Maybe it's more relaxing to watch from behind, Sheilz. :I

Look, I'm not having a go at anyone in particular (I love you all Maaaan!!!:approve:) or trying to be a killjoy:sleepy: (killjoys cars don't sound like mine :D), but let's try to keep games off public roads.

[Big Col]

I'm only a youngster and I agree with you elfman, you old fart you! ;)

[Sheilz]

You're probably right about the F1-ing. Haven't done it myself and from the back it is fun to watch. Have absolutely no disagreements with you about safety etc and didn't think you were having a go at anyone in particular.
Wouldn't get worried about being an 'old fart' it can be fun sometimes!
(oops - have I given myself away?)
:D:D:D:D

[ELFMAN]

See? This is why NMS folks are :cool:cool:cool:!

Thanks for getting where I was coming from!:D.
Don't feel quite so old and farty now :I. Well no more than usual.....;).

[Big Col]

Awwww the Elfsters going all sentimental. You wanna start a group hug chief? ;):D

[silver son]

Sorry to have to say that this is exactly why i have only been on one run and wont be attending any others. Just cant be bothered with this sort of hassle and strong personality clashes im afraid.

[ELFMAN]

Nothing wrong with the odd (or very odd) hug, but then again, we are Scottish, so it's probably against the law....

Silver Son - Don't "Get yer Coat" yet and don't judge NMS on one (fairly out of character) argument (I'm referring to the earlier 'stuff' at the beginning of this thread), or one run. Or is it the thought of a group hug? If we can stick to the simple common-sense ground-rules for runs sort things out by discussing whatever narks people in an adult fashion, leaving out the verbal handbags, I reckon we can have a successful 2005.

I've been on quite a few NMS runs (would have been on more but for Holidays and Kidney Stones!) in the past couple of years, and have enjoyed 90% of it. It's a great way to enjoy your MINI and meet a decent and diverse bunch of folks connected by their cars. For instance, the trip to Skye and overnight stay a while back was just fantastic, and we've had more fun than hassles as far as I can remember. I haven't noticed a lot of "strong personality clashes" in my time with NMS. Everybody butts heads once in a while, but such is life.

If something bugs you, you talk about it, like me and the "weaving" thing. It wasn't the people, who are great (another hug, guys?), but the practice which I wasn't up for. Maybe talking about it has sorted it? Maybe everybody will weave about on the next run just to p*$$ me off. Let's wait and see. Not something I'd fall out with anyone about or chuck NMS for unless something well-stupid happened. Life's too short - and so am I.

So I hope you reconsider and will come along to another run. The runs in the Spring and Summer are great fun and a lot cheaper on windscreen skoosh juice! (But surprisingly slightly dearer in petrol.....) If you are chucking in NMS, drive safely and enjoy your motor!

[Kirsty]

Didn't notice the additional bits you had added Euan sorry!! (I'm a wee bitty slow) I do agree with what you said, didn't take it the wrong way nor will I go in a huff!! If I don't wiggle about too much I'll join in the group hug!! :)

[X30YES]

quote:Originally posted by Kirsty

Didn't notice the additional bits you had added Euan sorry!! (I'm a wee bitty slow) I do agree with what you said, didn't take it the wrong way nor will I go in a huff!! If I don't wiggle about too much I'll join in the group hug!! :)
(wee bitty slow ):D...you havin a larf or what ..at least someone is on this subject ;)

[ELFMAN]

I reckon a certain ampunt of 'wiggling' should be mandatory during group hugs, just as long as you're not doing it in the middle of the road..............

See - sense of humour present and correct!

[ELFMAN]

The word "ampunt" is a typo, and not a measurement of the afforementioned wiggling.........
Sorry.

[Kirsty]

Hee heee!! I'lll take that as a yes then!! HEE HEE!! Thanks Euan!!

[Burple]

quote:Originally posted by Kirsty

Thank you!! It is a wee bit silly tho I agree!! :I I'll maybe stick to flying in future (if I have a passenger) a bit safer and at least its only a bloody (blood covered not swearing honest) arm hitting the cars windscreen behind if were not careful!! HEE HEE!!! Nik will like the flying one better!! :D


Oi!!

I'm watching!!
I'm now applying for Copyright for 'Mini Flying'.....
:p:p:evil::p:p:evil::p:p:blackeye::evil::p:D

[Kirsty]

quote:Originally posted by low_n_loud1


quote:Originally posted by Kirsty

Thank you!! It is a wee bit silly tho I agree!! :I I'll maybe stick to flying in future (if I have a passenger) a bit safer and at least its only a bloody (blood covered not swearing honest) arm hitting the cars windscreen behind if were not careful!! HEE HEE!!! Nik will like the flying one better!! :D


Oi!!

I'm watching!!
I'm now applying for Copyright for 'Mini Flying'.....
:p:p:evil::p:p:evil::p:p:blackeye::evil::p:D




Sorry folks forgot to mention that it was LnL that was so kind as to introduce a few of us to the spectaclar flying minis!! :cool: So full deomonstrations are curtesy of LnL and Flick!!! Sorry dear!! :I (runs away kinda sheepish!) No not sheep p**h!! Before anyone starts!! :p

[Tam1314]

Well any runs that we go on this year, we will just be taking them at our own speed

[rockwellcm]

i think everyone should read the original post again re rules,i myself will be thinking twice about my next run,all i can say is the Manky Thrash was taken at a far from relaxing speed for me and Pat,while the secret bunker run was taken at a better pace.
I do not see the `fun` in tearing around secondary roads at excessive speed,if i wanted to do that i would take my car to a track day,where i would only be endangering myself,not other law abiding members of the public.
because of the excessive speed on the manky thrash,on the last few miles i missed a turn,trying to keep up with the mini in front,and i was about half way in the group.
while the day was far from a downer,it did cause me to reflect `is this type of thing for me`and the jury is still out on that one,as i dont judge thinks from just 2 runs.
it is also down to the condition of the car,some minis on the run,are stock,and some heavely customed,making some of the cars handle very diffrent from others (the differance in making a corner at 60mph or hitting the ditch)
any fool can put there foot on an accelerator pedal,but with a group all pushing themselfs,its only a matter of time before someone comes a cropper,or worse an other motorist (who might not have as safe a car as a Mini),who just went out for a Sunday run,and was hit by some clown in a Mini,going too fast.

if i remember the original post correctly `its not a race` rings with me

Thinking it through
Donald

[Craig]

I was not on the Manky Thrash, so can't really comment on what you've said, BUT, any runs which I organise are always within the speed limits. :D

As you point towards, there are very different cars, different driver experience and road conditions, AND we are all in a group, so it's much better to just enjoy the roads, scenery and the fact you are out with friends and their minis..

I do hope this hasn't put you off going on other runs as that would be a real shame.

I do often get called a "grannie" driver on runs, but I like to think that this means less chance of people/cars being damaged. I believe driving at whatever speed you want, is for exactly that - when you are out for a drive on your own, not on a run..

Anyway, If you can make it, we would love to see you on the 29th Dec at the Xmas Cracker

(this is my own opinion and not everyone will agree ;))

[AndyP & Lenore]

As run organisers, we can't stress strongly enough how we rely on feedback from the run participants. Our first run in August 2005 started off at a steady even pace, but ended up quite fast. "Too fast in places" was the majority of the feedback we got. It was our first run, so we took that on board and every run since then has been at a more sedate pace all through.

Like Craig says, you're there to enjoy the scenery of an area you may not be familiar with, and you can't do that at excessive speeds.

We assisted Neil & Lorna with the Secret Bunker run and (although I can't speak for them directly) we are delighted you enjoyed this run.

Best advice we can offer is to speak to the organiser of any run beforehand to ask what the "pace" plan is. If you don't like what you hear, give it a miss.

A & L.

[Duncan Stewart]

I found the pace of the "Manky Thrash" the best on a run for a while. There was some spirited driving (thats what Minis are for :D ) but nothing dangerous that I saw. Most recent runs have been a bit too sedate in my opinion (and in the opinion of many others I've spoken to) for various reasons - traffic, largish numbers of cars on the run that the organisers are trying to keep together, "grannie" drivers as Craig calls them, etc.
All the NMS runs have excellent run directions provided so if you feel you don't want to keep up with the car in front then there should be no problem finding your way to the next regroup.
I'd hate to see NMS runs become a slow moving traffic jam causing other road users problems.
I hope this experience has not put you off as the runs are great fun :)

[Crombers]

As 'pace car' for the Xmas Cracker Run , I ain't gonna be breaking any speed limits. Can't say that the folk at the back wont as they'll be playing catch up. Sit towards the front on a run & you'll be just fine , step back a bit & things get a little more spirited :p

[Craig]

Duncan, I understand what your saying, but you have been the only one to say the the runs recently have been "too slow". I, like Andy love some feedback, however I have only had the usual comments. The problem with speeding up the runs is if I am at the front, I am already doing the speed limit ? ? what do you suggest I do ? ?

I cannot see how doing the speed limit would cause a rolling road block for other road users ? ? ?

As an organiser of the odd run, I could not live with myself if someone was hurt on a run whilst doing over the speed limit. You say that everyone has directions, however as has been proved on various runs recently, even people with navigators get lost and this causes people anxiety and sometimes arguments in the car, is it not better to be in a group and get the great reactions of people as you go by ?

what is the point of going on a run with other mini drivers in a club if you end up driving by yourself 'cos everyone else has disappeared into the horizon? I don't think that would make many new members feel welcome..

I will continue to organise my runs as I have done previously, if that puts some off, then so be it. Maybe this will start a divide of fast and road legal runs... anyway, runs are fun what ever speed you do and that is afterall why we go on them:approve::approve:

<get's off soapbox....>

[AndyP & Lenore]

Craig, you beat me to it. Agree with everything you just said.:D

Only thing I would add is that Duncan is suggesting that if you don't want to stick with the group, follow the notes (if only Duncan had followed our carefully laid out notes on the last HotB run!) and go at your own pace. Mini Runs are like lines of sheep; we all follow the car in front. If someone wants to drop back and take their "own" pace they will inevitably, have a group of MINI's behind them following them.

A.:D

[sedgie]

Well i have enjoyed every run i have been on:D...yes i liked the speed of the manky thrash but i also liked the slower speed of argyll run n the borders run, i personally did not think the manky thrash run was to fast!...and i do not drive a souped up modded car!:)but yes i like to have a lil play in my mini....thats what it's for....fun!

[Gismo]

quote:Originally posted by rockwellcm
i think everyone should read the original post again re rules,i myself will be thinking twice about my next run, all i can say is the Manky Thrash was taken at a far from relaxing speed for me and Pat,while the secret bunker run was taken at a better pace
This is the first complaint i've received from anyone :eek: whilst i'm not against receiving critisism or advice, i do feel that waiting for over a month to post up on the site for all to see without even mentioning to me on the day of the run, or privately first to express your views. as you have done as innappropriate.
I will however answer your points as best i can


quote:Originally posted by rockwellcm
I do not see the `fun` in tearing around secondary roads at excessive speed, if i wanted to do that i would take my car to a track day,where i would only be endangering myself, not other law abiding members of the publicWould you honestly drive your car around a track, or is this just to emphasise your point.
Personally, i do see the 'fun' in tearing around secondary roads, but, unlike you, i can enjoy it, though i wouldn't use the expression, excessive speed.


quote:Originally posted by rockwellcm
Because of the excessive speed on the manky thrash, on the last few miles i missed a turn,trying to keep up with the mini in front,and i was about half way in the groupYou were in fact 3rd from last as was explained to me, behind you were the Weefossy's and a Subaru.
You did call me twice, me Julie and i both gave you further directions to help you get back on track, i told you to follow the instructions and that we would meet up at the finish point.
From this point on you must have driven at excessive speed under your own heavy right foot as you missed yet another turn, though understandable as you were eager to rejoin the group.
The second turning you missed saved you 5 mins from the correct route and given that i knew where you were in relation to the second call astounded me that you got to the finish well ahead of the main group.
I'm sorry to say, unlike many others who organise runs, i was not prepared to stop the main group of approx 25 cars on secondary roads to the endangerment of other public road users trying to pass us to allow you to catch up, which, is just as well as you deviated from the route, unintentionally.


quote:Originally posted by rockwellcm
while the day was far from a downer,it did cause me to reflect `is this type of thing for me`and the jury is still out on that one, as i dont judge things from just 2 runs.
It is also down to the condition of the car, some minis on the run,are stock,and some heavely customed, making some of the cars handle very diffrent from others (the differance in making a corner at 60mph or hitting the ditch) any fool can put their foot on an accelerator pedal, but with a group all pushing themselfs,its only a matter of time before someone comes a cropper, or worse another motorist (who might not have as safe a car as a Mini),who just went out for a Sunday run,and was hit by some clown in a Mini,going too fastIf you are prepared to nominate who were the clowns in mini's going too fast on my run i will galdly not allow them to participate on any future runs i organise

<bloc

[ianking]

I agree that the runs are meant to be fun and within everyones capabilities and I believe that they all are.
However I also agree with Duncan that the manky thrash was probably the best run I have ever been on as we did get to push on a little. It cant have been that fast as I drive a Cooper and there were several S works cars there and I had them in my sights at all times.
I am very gratefull to all those that take the time to organise runs as I really enjoy them, it is nice once and a while though to get a good quick run round the back roads.

[Scottie]

I wasn't on the manky thrash so no idea whether it was fast slow or otherwise.

In fact what I think as fast some people may think it is slow.

slower runs Craigs one for example which is held in August we are travelling some of the best roads in Scotland but also some of the busiest routes with Tourist.

However if I'm being a 100% honest and true to myself with 6 points on my licence.

Sitting here at my desk the sensible me would have to say it's not clever to speed especially on roads you don't know. You never know what's round that corner.

Ok that's said.


The best advice that I can give you is sit near to the front of the run keep space with the mini in front close enough not to loose them keeping them in sight at all times but back enough should anything happen it's the Mini in front that is going to get it and not you ( I know that sounds bad but it's a fact):).

Always make sure you have a passenger that can read directions/maps hence (I drive and Allan navigates) most notes will warn you or really bad bends any dangers etc the navigator should warn you as you approach these this is the recipe we use and it works a treat.

Also can I just add that once you have been on several runs you get to know how the other drivers drive and you realise who you can have fun with and know that they are not going to do anything stupid etc etc.

I congratulate all the people who organise runs it can't be easy infact at times it may even be stressful without them owning a Mini would be less fun. :D:cool:

[The Dogfather]

Everyone should drive at their own pace and not be drawn along by the car in front. Most runs have directions and re-grouping points, if you're a slower driver you just get less time at the re-group. Simple.

BS - the pace was spot on, and I wasn't even driving a MINI

[Duncan Stewart]

Oh dear! :disapprove::I I have no intention of upsetting anyone, especially the people willing to put in the hard work to organise runs.
Its interesting that the feedback on pace that Andy / Craig have had are different to what I have heard
I am in no way suggesting we drive illegally nor suggesting that on runs the lead car should break speed limits. Nor do I think any recent run has become so slow it is a rolling traffic jam, I am simply saying we need to move at the same speed as the main flow of traffic to avoid causing a hazard - something I think we are always good at doing on runs.
On runs I always try to keep the car in front and behind in view but this is not always possible and I have always found the instructions excellent if I do get split from the group.

But come on, lighten up guys - I make mistakes, get lost , just like many others - we are all human

This is supposed to be fun :D :p

[Scottie]

quote:Originally posted by Duncan Stewart

Its interesting that the feedback on pace that Andy / Craig have had are different to what I have heard



I'm interested in this one Duncan. that's bold staement to make I would think we hear all the same feed back. In fact the organisers I reckon will hear more than you and I.

Intersting isn't it that both you and I are commenting on the speeds of runs as far as I can tell you and I are about the only 2 old timers who have never organised a run,

Maybe we should put up or shut up. What you reckon.;):p:D

[The Dogfather]

quote:Originally posted by ScottieCoop
as far as I can tell you and I are about the only 2 old timers who have never organised a run,

Maybe we should put up or shut up. What you reckon.;):p:D


I wouldn't say shut up but you should get your finger out and organise a run ;):p

One more point to make, we will all have different ideas at what speeds are safe, the key is to drive within your abilities. Slower is not always safer, I certain female I know drives very slowly but she scares the crap out of me as she just doesn't see hazards until she on top of them.

[Duncan Stewart]

:D:D:D I've shut up, consider my big mouth zipped and my need for speed curbed :clown::eek::p:):D

[Duncan Stewart]

quote:Originally posted by Duncan Stewart

recent runs have been a bit too sedate in my opinion for various reasons - traffic, largish numbers of cars on the run that the organisers are trying to keep together, "grannie" drivers as Craig calls them, etc.


Oops! :I
I've just re read the recent posts to see why folk got so upset and saw I mis-read Craigs first post! - Sorry Craig, I had skim read it and thought your referral to "Grannie" drivers was to slow motorists we sometimes encounter on runs, not yourself. I can see why my post would seem provocative now.
I never though you have held up a run with your driving pace and did not mean to imply this - I hope you accept my apologies

Note to self - read posts properly in future :clown:

[john]

As it has been said its NOT a race therefore if you drive at a snail pace you will be

(a)comfortable with your speed
(b) less likely to get lost
(c)happy and maybe come on another run:)

Every run I have been on the front runners have always waited at the designated points to wait for the last person to arrive.

My tuppence worth :)


PS There will be a Cullen run this coming year and as usual will cater for pace of all drivers :cool:

[Craig]

quote:Originally posted by Duncan Stewart


quote:Originally posted by Duncan Stewart

recent runs have been a bit too sedate in my opinion for various reasons - traffic, largish numbers of cars on the run that the organisers are trying to keep together, "grannie" drivers as Craig calls them, etc.


Oops! :I
I've just re read the recent posts to see why folk got so upset and saw I mis-read Craigs first post! - Sorry Craig, I had skim read it and thought your referral to "Grannie" drivers was to slow motorists me sometime encounter on runs, not yourself. I can see why my post would seem provocative now.
I never though you have held up a run with your driving pace and did not mean to imply this - I hope you accept my apologies

Note to self - read posts properly in future :clown:





Duncan - we all make mistakes, apology accepted :D Hope to see you on one of my slower runs in future ;):approve:

[Duncan Stewart]

quote:Originally posted by Craig & Jude
Hope to see you on one of my slower runs in future ;):approve:


Your runs are always great fun so I will be there :D
I have honestly really enjoyed all the runs and look forward to more.

[Gismo]

quote:Originally posted by john
PS There will be a Cullen run this year and as usual will cater for pace of all drivers :cool:Well, there's only a few days left for this year, so, maybe you meant next year :I:D

[john]

quote:Originally posted by Bonnie Scotland


quote:Originally posted by john
PS There will be a Cullen run this year and as usual will cater for pace of all drivers :cool:Well, there's only a few days left for this year, so, maybe you meant next year :I:D


You missed it as you were in that far away place:)

[Crombers]

quote:Originally posted by john

PS There will be a Cullen run this coming year and as usual will cater for pace of all drivers :cool:


Oh yes :approve:, put me down for this one :cool:

[aafj]

If it's not already been said use Walkie Talkies they help keep groups together and inform of obstructions, forthcoming junctions pedestrians in the road etc