TPMS and aftermarket wheels

[donnaj1dlh]

A question regarding aftermarket wheels....
Do any of you guys have aftermarket alloys fitted and no longer use tyre pressure sensors? Is it something that can be turned off or do you get an annoying error message all the time?
I asked this question on another forum and I'm getting conflicting responses.

I'm planning for the future and thinking about ordering up a set of winter alloys/wheels but obviously don't want to spend the £1000+ MINI will want for OEM ones.

I have 17" wheels on my F56 MCS but 16"s were an option (so I know they could fit).

First conflicting advice I got was from the Service mannie at my dealer who lead me to believe the standard wheels don't have a pressure sensor in the wheels and the car calibrates when the cars driving blah blah ... I think this is wrong? I understand its a brand new model but I thought they'd know this stuff.

mytyres.co.uk now have packages available for the MCS ..... all be it on 16" wheels....
6.50 J x 16 OS 50 DEZENT RE Matt black rims with Goodyear Ultragrip 8 Performance(with rim protection) 195x55xR16 87H
all for £617! ...hence why I want to get them now before the price rockets in October with arrival of the first frosts!

Some others reckon I'll need a 'spignot' ring to make them fit as well.

other websites have 17" wheels available with my correct tyres 205x45x17s but how do I find out the actual dimensions of my rims?

I've never bought aftermarket wheels before and I want to make sure I get it right!! Surely I won't have to spend £100s more on sensors to fit to the wheels first? I really wanted to get a whole set to save me swapping tyres every six months as various tyre fitters made a right mess of my last alloys over three years.

Perhaps you guys can advise somewhere to go for some trustworthy advice ..... I'm in Aberdeenshire.

[MINI William]

The tyre inflation sensor is calculated by the ABS, and if one tyre is turning slower than the other this would indicate a flat tyre and would show the warning light. This can be reset on the car by going into the menu through the BC button on the indicator stock (R56 would imagine very similar on F56, or if you have Media then there will be an option in the Vehical Information menu) this would need reset after replacing/ fixing a flat tyre or if changing the wheels and tyre on the car.

[donnaj1dlh]

Thanks Will, That makes more sense .... more like what the Service mannie said!
When I got my wheels swapped over last Friday (to the correct ones I had actually ordered!) , I asked if the new 'sensors' had been recalibrated and he said "just drive and it'll do it itself" ...sure enough as every time I stopped at traffic lights the calibration paused.
So I should be ok with different alloys then?

[Craig]

I would think you will be fine. Normally just a reset of the system required after changeover of wheels. I haven't heard Of them putting sensors in the wheels as William says all previous systems have been hub sensors linked to the ABS..


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[badwolf340]

All that would be required as said is a reset:thumbs up:

[Eddie_JCW]

I believe the F56 does have sensors as the car knows what pressure is in each tyre now. Also the valve stems are different which is also leading me to believe they have sensors.

[Eddie_JCW]

Donna do you have the last 7 digits of your VIN handy?
Type in this site http://www.bmwarchive.org/vin/bmw-vin-decoder.html
You're looking to see if you have S2VBA tyre pressure display if you do then you'll need sensors. I think the other telltale is metal valve stems.

I checked Realoem and there are sensors if you have S2VBA

[Eddie_JCW]

I asked my cousin who works at BMW, if you just have normal black rubber valve stems then you don't have sensors, if you have metal ones with a grey cap then you do.

[donnaj1dlh]

Thanks Eddie, I can check. I know that I have the metal valve stems (annoyingly they are silver on black wheels ....grrr!)

I can imagine if I go ahead with wheels I need to find out if I can cancel any resulting error messages. It'll be annoying to live with for 4-5 months!

(you can ask your cousin that too ... he sounds like a handy person to know! :) )

[Eddie_JCW]

Found this- http://www.totalmini.com/forum/52-wheels-tyres-suspension-braking/8585-winter-tyres-new-mini-f56.html

Hope it helps :)

[donnaj1dlh]

Thanks for that Eddie, looks like it would be a case of buying the wheels and sensors to fit into them! Still might work out cheaper than OEM set price though.

I wonder if I bought the 'set' from mytyres they might be able to deliver them as rims and wheels so I can affix the sensors?

Or maybe I should just stay at home when it snows........

[donnaj1dlh]

A recent PM convo with Tangledfeet has reminded me to get this wheels issue sorted out.

I've been in touch with MINI and the TPS cannot be disabled. My local 'parts guy' I spoke to on the phone was really helpful last night and we discussed the options I had open to me .... although he freely admitted I was the first local to be showing an interest in F56 winter wheels/alloys, so it was a bit of a minefield for him.

MINI can supply wheels/tyres for approx. £1400 (this obviously includes valves). These are for 16" alloys .... there is no option of 16" steels for the MCS as they won't fit over the brakes. Bare with me, I don't have the tyre size at hand (scribbled on a bit of paper at home) but he did say there was a narrower tyre option available at £1200 for the set. Ovbiously narrower tyres will be slightly better in actual snow. He's offered a 5% discount.

He also let me know that the TPS valves themselves are £65 inc vat, so £260 for the set (eeeek!)

However, I was in touch with a guy from Wheelbasealloys (not sure if any of you guys have dealt with them) but they offer MINI fitment alloys/winters at £600-£1000 per set depending on tyre/wheel choice. I saw a nice enough set for ~£800 and was told I was welcome to buy valves, send them to wheelbasealloys and have them fitted to the wheels/tyres. So this would still come in less that MINI originals, by £200-£400.

My question is this .... do I spend more on genuine MINI wheels or buy the others. Which ones would sell on better second hand?

[EcosseGP]

Personally I'd buy whichever ones you preferred the look of. I wouldn't worry about the second hand market at all. If it was me I wouldn't be bothered about buying genuine MINI wheels that's for sure especially if they're only for winter use (why wreck an expensive set of wheels) ..

[donnaj1dlh]

That's what I reckoned. On wheelbasealloys their cheapest 16" MINI compatible alloy were these:

http://www.wheelbasealloys.com/alloy-wheels/dezent/re/silver/16-inch/195-55-16/vredestein/snowtrac-3/h-max-130-mph

or 17"s were these.....

http://www.wheelbasealloys.com/alloy-wheels/msw/19/matt-black/17-inch/205-45-17/maxxis/ma-pw/v-max-149-mph

(then remember to add on £250 for sensors)
The bonus of the 17"s of course, is knowing (should I need it) there are replacement wheels in the shed should I kerb one/puncture (do fine for an emergency!)

[tangledfeet]

Well...

I've got four 15" steel rims on order from HF (should be with me next week), I've just ordered a set of Nokian WR D3 winter tyres (Auto Express 2014 #1 winter tyre) from tyreleader.co.uk and will get local tyre fitter to fit tyres and balance - I should be looking at just under £400 all told. Will be able to change wheels over myself and have plenty of storage space.

Chatting to donnaj1dlh and now seeing this has made me wonder what the TPMS will do! I can live with an amber light but a persistent audible alarm... eek!

I've had winter tyres before and know how much of a difference they make; wanted to fit them to my new Mini as cheaply as possible. Roads in rural Fife aren't the best in summer and we live in one of the highest parts!

[donnaj1dlh]

I'm going to fit them to be on the safe side, since they cannot be disabled. I'd be naffed off if I didn't fit them and the car bonged at me constantly. Even at a£250 add on or so, it's still not a dear set of complete wheels.

I still haven't found out FOR CERTAIN if the alarm is visual or audible. Visual I can live with, audible NOT! Also I've read conflicting reports about lack of sensors affecting the cruise control etc. I wish I could get a definite response......

[tangledfeet]

I've not got cruise control so don't have to consider that!

I'm just reading through the manual and p81-83 doesn't mention any audible alarms at all - only the yellow warning light being illuminated...

(Fingers crossed!)

[Craig]

Could (as a club ) not arrange for an F56 to be in the same place as a CM/PM (as I believe the wheels are interchangeable) and put a set of CM/PM wheels on an F56 and test it out ? It would answer the question once and for all ?!?!?

[EcosseGP]

I know this sounds simple but ..
Why not just get the wheels and tyres sorted (without the valves) and fit them to the car and try them out. If it just the light that's illuminated and you can cope with it job done, if there's an audible warning then change the valves. Not really a hard job to remove tyre and refit a new valve (does increase the chance of getting a rubbish tyre fitter that might mark a wheel) ..

[Craig]

Found out the Info I was given Was utter crap. PCD for CM/PM IS 5x120. F56 is 5x112. Oh well that won't work

[tangledfeet]

I know this sounds simple but ..
Why not just get the wheels and tyres sorted (without the valves) and fit them to the car and try them out. If it just the light that's illuminated and you can cope with it job done, if there's an audible warning then change the valves. Not really a hard job to remove tyre and refit a new valve (does increase the chance of getting a rubbish tyre fitter that might mark a wheel) ..

Indeed; that's what I'm planning on doing; guess that makes me the guinea pig / crash test dummy! :crazypilot:

[EcosseGP]

I'd say it was a sensible way of doing it .. If it works it's job done and in the cheapest way possible.

[donnaj1dlh]

I was away to tell you Craig that that F56 is 5 stud when previously they've been four! Crack on then tangledfeet...... let us know what happens!!

[Angib]

but he did say there was a narrower tyre option available at £1200 for the set. Obviously narrower tyres will be slightly better in actual snow. He's offered a 5% discount.
It's worth pointing out that narrower tyres may well be better in deep snow but they will be worse all the rest of the time - dry roads, wet roads, ice, etc. Winter tyres have less cornering grip than summer tyres on wet roads, so choosing a tyre that works better in 1% of road conditions doesn't add up for me. If you are a gentle driver, it makes no difference.

I find that there is 10% discount available on any large purchase from a Mini spares counter, just for asking. The parts guy at my local dealers now apologises when he can't offer a discount on sub-£20 items.

Oh, and it was me that started the cruise control rumour, which is nothing more than a guess. But fairly minor things seem to have knock-on effects in a Mini ECU. When my Roadster's spoiler froze in the down position, it was amazing how many other things seemed to be affected.

[donnaj1dlh]

Valid point and I was aware of that Angib, but thanks for pointing it out. Hence why I reckon I'll probably go with the 17" wheelbasealloys ones :thumbs up:

[tangledfeet]

Crack on then tangledfeet...... let us know what happens!!

Will do! Even on my 'wee diddy 15" wheels..! :moonie:

Though at this rate they tyres won't be getting fitted to the rims until next pay day... once they are done I may well end up just fitting one even before the time comes, just to see what the affect will be on the TPMS - and I'll report back!

- - - Updated - - -


It's worth pointing out that narrower tyres may well be better in deep snow but they will be worse all the rest of the time - dry roads, wet roads, ice, etc. Winter tyres have less cornering grip than summer tyres on wet roads, so choosing a tyre that works better in 1% of road conditions doesn't add up for me. If you are a gentle driver, it makes no difference.

But roads can still be wet, but not ice, below 7deg.C or so; below that summer tyres lose grip and winter tyres retain theirs - irrespective of tyre width and whether or not you are a gentle driver. And much of Scotland stays below that sort of temperature for several months of the year.

[Angib]

But roads can still be wet, but not ice, below 7deg.C or so; below that summer tyres lose grip and winter tyres retain theirs - irrespective of tyre width and whether or not you are a gentle driver.
That's the advertising for winter tyres but it really only applies to traction and braking which is what the tread pattern of winter tyres is optimised for and at which they are stunningly brilliant. Everyone with winter tyres should go out on an empty wet road and brake sharply - if you apply the brakes quickly by stamping on them, even if you don't press very hard, the Mini's Brake Assist will apply the brakes right up to the point of locking and you can experience just how much ultimate grip winter tyres have in a straight line.

Cornering grip is a whole different matter and I would say a wet road has to be just about freezing before any winter tyre can corner as well as a decent summer one. So anything that improves the winter tyre's cornering ability, such as fitting a wider tyre, helps. For drivers that never slide their tyres in the wet, this won't be that great but for the more enthusiastic driver the difference is significant.

The same applies to icy roads where wider winter tyres definitely help (I've had 175s, 195s and 205s so far) - and to my mind, icy roads (or potentially icy roads) are the time when winter tyres really pay for themselves. For the many drivers that rarely drive far on un-gritted roads, this isn't a big benefit but for those of us regularly using minor roads, it's a major 'wing-saver' if not life-saver. I reckon last winter was the first time for several years that I wasn't aware of an occasion when my winter tyres saved me from sliding into a hedge or some other 'minor' crash that would actually cost many hundreds to fix.

So I think winter tyres are very much 'horses for courses' - no one size fits all.

[tangledfeet]

Cool, many thanks Angib - I got the (wrong) impression from your post above that you'd never actually tried them and were being dismissive! Didn't appreciate that you have them, or have had them in the past.

I used to commute 90miles/day and did so, at times, in some pretty grim winter weather; in particular the winter, I think, four years ago when the central belt came to a standstill - I was in the car for about ten hours, probably coming off lightly compared to many. It was indeed straight line driving where traction was prime - and that was where I found myself at a massive advantage to most others stuck in the snow.

Must admit that I did find the winter tyres I had on my last car were better in the wet than the tyres that came with the car; I noted a palpable difference in standing/surface water - but, as I said above, this may well have been more indicative of the (mediocre) tyres the car first came with!

[Angib]

The one thing that winter tyres really can't do is get you past all the people that have got stuck or are barely moving on summer tyres.... So empty roads are wonderful and snow-covered hills are best as everyone 'knows' that cars can't go up or down there, so they have their accidents elsewhere.

[KenL]

On the sensors, can you not move them from your current wheels and just fit them to your winter wheels?

[Mon the fish]

^^ You could but I'd imagine you'd be paying to take tyres off wheels, and back on, twice a year. If you were to do that, you'd be as well just having a set of winter tyres, and using the one set of rims all year round

[donnaj1dlh]

^^ You could but I'd imagine you'd be paying to take tyres off wheels, and back on, twice a year. If you were to do that, you'd be as well just having a set of winter tyres, and using the one set of rims all year round

Exactly right :(

[tangledfeet]

Right... tyres arrived the other week and picked up the rims on Monday after work. Was happy to find that the steel rims are actually black rather than silver; I had actually considered getting them powder coated but that would've been as much as the rims themselves and as these are winter tyres and rims I'm not too bothered.

When I collected the rims I was told that the car will offer an audible alarm when started and then a warning light; HF Kircaldy have experienced this very phenomena recently with a similar scenario - will confirm in a month or two!

5353

[Craig]

LOVE Nokian Winter Tyres ;). They are the best winter tyres I've ever had :)

[mini mad andy]

Another solution would be to switch off the TPMS during the winter via the ODB connector.


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[tangledfeet]

5452

The answer to the million dollar (well, a couple of hundred quid anyway) question...

Steel rims with Nokain WR D3's fitted last night - had no idea just how much easier this would be having invested £30 in a trolley jack! Took it out for a short drive last night and nothing happened so I did wonder whether the TPMS was actually working properly! However, on the way in to work this morning the car 'bonged' once after a few miles and then alerted me that the TPMS was not working. Amber warning light flashed for a moment or two then stay lit.

I can live with that over winter! Noticed the difference immediately on the damp, muddy rural roads in Fife at 5deg.C this morning.

[mikeswagon]

I fitted my steelies last weekend, the package complete with tpms on pirelli snowcontrols from mini.

As well as a discount, they very generously gave me about 40% more air in the tyres than I needed. Having verified the reading in the car using 2 separate handheld guages, and the airline at the garage I deflated them to 32, but forgot to reset the tmps again, which then shat itself a couple of miles down the road - DOH!

tangledfeet, does the car bong every time it's being driven?

[tangledfeet]

I fitted my steelies last weekend, the package complete with tpms on pirelli snowcontrols from mini.

As well as a discount, they very generously gave me about 40% more air in the tyres than I needed. Having verified the reading in the car using 2 separate handheld guages, and the airline at the garage I deflated them to 32, but forgot to reset the tmps again, which then shat itself a couple of miles down the road - DOH!

tangledfeet, does the car bong every time it's being driven?

How much did you pay for the Mini winter tyre and steel rim package..?

Car does remind me each time I start it; bongs once, states the TPMS 'error' and the amber light - I can live with that.

I commented to a colleague just yesterday that the tyre pressure on the Mini is much higher than in previous cars!

[mikeswagon]

How much did you pay for the Mini winter tyre and steel rim package..?

Car does remind me each time I start it; bongs once, states the TPMS 'error' and the amber light - I can live with that.

I commented to a colleague just yesterday that the tyre pressure on the Mini is much higher than in previous cars!

The package was £524 before discount, which suited me fine. I asked about just the wheels and tpms, as I fancied nokians, IIRC it was going to be around £424, so it made sense to get the package just now, and if I don't like the tyres they can be swapped next year.

Now that you're running like this, I imagine a lot more will do the same, doesn't sound too bad to live with, I was expecting a more frequent beeping as you drive.

[donnaj1dlh]

How come you got the so cheap Mike!!?? Did you go for 15" steelers? I was quoted £1400 for 16"! My winter shoes are at the garage getting assembled today, hopefully him indoors will put them on the MINI this week.

[tangledfeet]

Must admit that I'm a bit surprised too!

Would I be right in thinking that you paid £424 for steel rims including the TPMS sensors - and the tyres you got elsewhere, Mike..? That'd be about right for a steel rim (~£40) and TPMS sensor (~£65) times four.

[mikeswagon]

I was a bit surprised at the price, had to ask the dude to confirm that tpms were included. It was £524 all in with pirelli snowcontrols before discount, or approx £424 without the tyres, and would have been roughly another £60 for the wheel trims, but I didn't feel the need.

15inch steelies is how I roll for the winter:thumbs up:

5460

5461

[gauldrymini]

:thumbs up:

[donnaj1dlh]

They look alright though Mike! From a distance they don't even look like steels. I couldn't get the 15" steel option 'cos mine's the S .... 16 alloy was they smallest. So considering I was gonna be £1400 for 16s I reckon I might as well hold out for 17s ...at least I have 4 replacement wheels in the garage if I need them ...... even though they're silver! Might powder coat them though.......

[mikeswagon]

They look alright though Mike! From a distance they don't even look like steels. I couldn't get the 15" steel option 'cos mine's the S .... 16 alloy was they smallest. So considering I was gonna be £1400 for 16s I reckon I might as well hold out for 17s ...at least I have 4 replacement wheels in the garage if I need them ...... even though they're silver! Might powder coat them though.......

They're growing on me, and the exposed centres are transforming themselves into VO (it's not rust honest...), just waiting now for some white stuff to justify them:thumbs up:

I take it you need 16s for brake clearance? Was wondering if they might rethink this and offer 16" steelies in the future for you S types...

[donnaj1dlh]

I think 16"s is the largest size you get steels in generally.....I remember looking for my 207 when I had it (just plonked for tyres in the end), but MINI certainly didn't stock them for the F56. I didn't even try and find some in a F56 fitment 'cos I reckoned they were too new.

...it's a pity they've stuck the weights on the outside of the rim though, that look rough #OCD :)

You not gonna get VO MINI wheel caps then??? I was thinking about getting a set for my black Cosmos :)

[tangledfeet]

I'm waiting for some centre caps to arrive - eBay, from Bulgaria of all places. Only £3.99 including delivery.

I was taken aback at just how much heavier steel rims are than alloy!

[mikeswagon]

I reckon I could have sourced 16s from a merc fitment, but with tpms, tyres and the extra ££££s and hassle I couldn't be bothered.

The hole in the steelies is bigger than the one in the alloys, so centre caps don't fit. VO caps may get purchased for the alloys before they go back on though.....

tangledfeet: I didn't notice much difference in weights tbh. Could you post up a link for the caps you're waiting for please?

[gauldrymini]

I'm waiting for some centre caps to arrive - eBay, from Bulgaria of all places. Only £3.99 including delivery.

I was taken aback at just how much heavier steel rims are than alloy!

...any link?

[tangledfeet]

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/261652562322?txnId=0

Will confirm whether they fit when they arrive!

[gauldrymini]

^^^Cheers...

[tangledfeet]

^^^Cheers...

They don't fit - too small! Ach, well - only £4.

[gauldrymini]

http://www.minigenuineparts.co.uk/mini-parts/info_BM36_10_9_804_232.html

Had these for my steelies on the CM , which was a 5 stud, maybe they would fit the new F56/55

[tangledfeet]

Thanks, gauldrymini!

I think I'll just leave the wheels as is; don't really want to throw much more money at the winter wheels. I've had the Vernier callipers out (none of this digital nonsense - I'm 'old school'!) and I know that the internal diameter is 59mm - so I may just keep looking on eBay for cheap solutions. I must admit that it would be nice to find something to give the hubs a bit of protection from winter wet and corrosion.

[donnaj1dlh]

Fitted my winter wheels at the weekend. Car given it's winter polish and wax and then the trims treated with Nanolex Trim Rejuvenator so we'll see how they stand up to the onslaught of salt/grit!

5468

[gauldrymini]

:thumbs up:

[tangledfeet]

Nice work! Think I'll be needing some of that Nanolex stuff after winter.

Do you use an electric polisher, Donna? I've never actually waxed a car before getting my mini and I think I might be more inclined to keep it clean with one...

[EcosseGP]

Cars looking good Donna :)
There's no need to use an electric polisher every time you polish the car .. Once it's done right the upkeep is easy :):)

[Craig]

Nice Donna - that's you ready for the winter now :)

And like Davy says, you should only need to machine very rarely especially if your washing technique and care of your paintwork is correct thereafter :)


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[tangledfeet]

I'm a newbie when it comes to looking after car paintwork; I applied Collinite by hand back in July and wondered whether I could justify getting one being a lazy sod... :Whistle:

[donnaj1dlh]

We've asked for money from the outlaws for Xmas to go towards a DA polisher (never used one). We'll try it out on our 9 year old Freelander first like!!

I've never used Collinite, but I know a lot of people who use it particularly for winter protection. We use Dodo Juice Supernatural Carnuba wax that comes in the fancy wooden pot :)

[CiderFex]

I was a newbie with a DA this year Donna.
Very easy to use and the results are amazing.

There may be a thread about them on here somewhere else.

You will get loads of advice on which one to buy in regards to pads and polishes.

Mi Mam bought me mine for last X-Mas and it is without doubt in my top 3 of best ever X-Mas pressies.
:)

...to Infinity and beyond !!!

[tangledfeet]

I did some digging around a few months ago and found that the Deltalyo DAS-6 and the Pro version seem to the ones most recommended.

Just counted out the coffee jar into which all 1p, 2p, 5p, 10p, 20p and £2 coins go at the end of the day... £164 now in money bags that I can take to the bank! Half of that would get me the DAS-6.

[CiderFex]

I have the Das 6 Pro and it's awesome.
Try "Clean Your Car" because Tim will mix and match his deals to suit your needs.

http://www.cleanyourcar.co.uk

...to Infinity and beyond !!!

[donnaj1dlh]

It's Clean Your Car vouchers we've asked the outlaws for. But it'll be boy wonders choice which one we go for :)

[EcosseGP]

I would recommend the DAS 6 pro as a starter machine and like Pete says it's easy to use ..
It's the pads and polishes that make the difference depending on what you want from it ..

[tangledfeet]

What's the 'Pro' version got over the standard model?

[EcosseGP]

Tbh the Das6 pro has more power that's all in a nutshell .. well worth the money for that alone in IMO
There's other options along the same line .. Meguiars, dodo juice, kestrel but it's all about the trade off between power, smoothness of the machine, noise, etc ..
Also please do not expect the machine to produce perfect results the first time you use it .. it does take time to master the art of machine polishing :)