2009 Cooper D mmmmmmmm

[Fester]

Is it just me or is the newer minis not as good (good is the wrong word so is nice but cant think of the right word) as the older ones. Had a 09plate Cooper D as a courtesy car for the last couple of days while my trusty old 02 One was back at JC getting the door repaired. I didnt like it:eek:

Before every one starts shouting at me it is a good driving car and the build quality seems to be better but..........

1. even with the seat adjusted down still felt like I was sitting up too high
2. steering felt unresponsive
3. interior felt smaller
4, not keen on the dash, if you ignore the HUGE speedo there is a definate BMW influence, kinda looses the mini coolness
5. Diesel engine noisy

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/stevedear/minicooperd.jpg

so Is it just me being picky and missing my own car or anyone else prefer the previous variants??

Stephen

[KenL]

No Stephen it is not just you. Despite the R56 being out for more than 2 years there is still a lot of debate about which is best.

...but I say...

I had a 2002 ONE and as much as I loved it, it was rubbish in a lot of ways, build quality and ride quality especially. I did not want another and bought a mkV Golf after owning it for 23 months.

When the R56 came along I went to a launch night and REALLY liked it. Without driving it, I knew it was a lot better built and more grown up than my R50.

Took a test drive and loved it, just so much better all round I thought.

[Bazthemod]

I wasn't the biggest R56 fan until one day something clicked and i understood what direction mini were taking.... when i look at pics of my 1st gen car it looks dated, especially the interior.

I don't think the new interior is by any means boring if you splash the cash for nice trim finishes.

The new diesel is an improvement on the 1.4 Toyota engine the last gen had too.

Just my opinions :smilewinkgrin:

[Fester]

Maybe was just me, probably if had it for a few more days might have appreciated it a bit more, but when I jumped back into mine this afternoon just felt better sounds daft I know.

[Scottie]

R50, R52, R53 and or R56. I like them all. I think perhaps your suffering from the comfy slippers syndrome.:p:smilewinkgrin::smilewinkgrin:

[Fester]

Ha you could be right "bragging rights mine is better than yours"

But do swear that the interior feels smaller. Me and my wide arse definatly felt more cocooned. :Whistle:

[GCA3N]

well I have had my R56 S for 2 days now and the way i would put it is kinda grown up from the R50. It certainly feels and looks better built and drives amazing, but then I have jumped from a cooper to an S so there will be that. I have said this before the older shape is prettier no doubt and has something that the new ones don't have, can't put my finger on it. I like most of the interior and especially the small mode lights dotted all round the interior cabin.

[AndyP & Lenore]

We jump from our R53 to our R56 and back again almost daily. If anything I would say the R53 feels slightly smaller than the R56, so I guess it's a perspective thing.:confused:

A.:D

[Crombers]

No vote for me , the R50/3 is by far the better looking car.

I liken it to Volkswagen when they moved from MKII Golf to the MKIII (especially in GTi format). I remember oh so clearly at the time thinking WTF!!

MINI missed the boat on the MKII IMHO , just my 2p. I suppose in a way it is difficult with a MINI as it will always have to look like a MINI and in my opinion it looks as if they have changed for changes sake i.e. it was time to do so. I mean compare the clam bonnet in the MkI & then look at what they did on the MkII :confused:, what looks the better there?

I wish it were not the case as I would love to be in that showroom last year/this year with a big wad deposit :sad:

[Gismo]

I had a shot of Zimbo's D and was pleasantly surprised at the performance of the engine.
Sadly, i still aint keen on the interior and hate the fact that BMW have decided that i can't fit an aftermarket head unit :ragin:

As for the bonnet, that was down to cost, the new model's is far cheaper to manufacture.

[Big Gordy]

Its been well documented on this forum that I'm not keen on the R56 shape:frown:
Think its more MAXI than MINI now:argh:
The world would be a right dull place if we all liked same things tho:thumbs up:

[Stewart]

Speaking to a guy up at the gym, I knew he had a Mini before an old R53 version and had now got an 08 Dooper.

I cant compare as I never owned the older version, and you really need to live with a car I think to appreciate it. But he said it was his third Mini now and the Cooper D was the best he had driven. His first Mini was when they first came out and he said it looked fantastic but all it did was go back to the garage for problem after problem and was in his words a heap. His second a newer 53 Cooper was better but had engine problems, Steering rack problems and rattled and poor MPG.


His D he said was fantastic for the months he had it. Road tax of £35, 56 MPG and drives so much better and feels solid around town. He just felt everything was an improvement. His old Cooper nearly made him buy a new golf but took the D out and thought the R56 was miles ahead……….on his old Mini.

[Bazthemod]

The bonnet also has to sit higher to pass pedestrian collision tests so that makes it seem fatter. Bloody pedestrians shouldn't be in the way!:p :moonie:

[camjay]

I also posted recently that I prefer the look and the interior of the R50. I'm really not keen on the interior of this one at all. I don't think the quality is as good, but that was my opinion and many disagreed with me. In saying that, I prefer the drive of the Cooper D. I can't say I've noticed it being noisy, but I do notice a difference in driving, I much prefer this one, the torque is great - its a right nippy wee thing and would say its a better drive than my last mini. But, as I've said before - each to their own. :thumbs up:

[zimbo]

Well this is my 3rd (NEW) mini now and this one as mentioned by The Gismo Man is a Cooper D and I have loved all my minis equally, yes I do miss the fact that I dont have my playmini exhaust anymore and cant listen to that nice burble it had or the fact that I cant change my stereo to the one I would like to put in (YET!!) or the fact that the R56 speedo is HUGEEEE:Whistle: ...but I LOVE my CooperD to bits now and dont really see me voluntarily getting rid of it any time soon unless circumstances mean I have too. I mean, £35 road tax, up to 82MPG or as low as 48MPG (perthshire pleasure run) and the sport button, the torque!!! etc etc and the big grin on my face everytime I drive her. Shes a wee sheep in wolfs clothing...

I LOVE MY D... :yes nod: :D

[Stewart]

I’m probably going to get one next if not a an S……..if they bring out a newer model in a few years with better economy an S might be on the cards. Although how can you beat that torque with that MPG and Road Tax of a Dooper.

[GCA3N]

I’m probably going to get one next if not a an S……..if they bring out a newer model in a few years with better economy an S might be on the cards. Although how can you beat that torque with that MPG and Road Tax of a Dooper.


You would be surprised with the old fuel economy. I have been driving all over the place the last few days, mostly short runs (mostly on sport mode) and getting 40 to the gallon, not bad, and my road tax has gone down quite a bit on my R50.

[Stewart]

When I read before I got my car the older S cars were getting 23 MPG I thought that’s not for me, even the older R53 Coopers were not that great. But then this R56 came out and thought that’s more like it.

Had the sport button on in the Cooper yesterday as before I just could not see the difference but I put it on at gave it some beans and there was a difference in the acceleration just a sharpness that’s not there when its off. Think the thing I was doing wrong was I was just pressing sport on and driving my usual way……


Do you press Sport on & DSC off:D

[Fairy]

Well imho I really dont like the R56...they just look like a Mini thats had an allergic reaction and has swollen up!!! :frown: Should have left the Mini alone after the R53 and the bonnet scoop looks daft since there is a turbo behind it!
The lag is terrible in the S and the car is clumpy, oversized and u.g.l.y to be honest - sorry guys i'll stick with my likkle supercharged beast!

[ianking]

Well imho I really dont like the R56...they just look like a Mini thats had an allergic reaction and has swollen up!!! :frown: Should have left the Mini alone after the R53 and the bonnet scoop looks daft since there is a turbo behind it!
The lag is terrible in the S and the car is clumpy, oversized and u.g.l.y to be honest - sorry guys i'll stick with my likkle supercharged beast!

What? Turbo lag. Away!!!

Hardly any with my R56S and none at all with my R56 JCW.
Pulls quicker than any of the supercharged ones I have driven, inc the GP.

[Fairy]

What? Turbo lag. Away!!!


Well I definitely felt lag when we test drove it!!! When you hit the peddle in the R53 obviously the supercharger is instant but in the R56 you need to wake it up!!!! Its soooo un-exciting! C'mon Mini!!!!!

[ianking]

With the sport button on its very responsive.

[Fairy]

sorry but u shouldn't need a sports button

[Smitty]

With the sport button on its very responsive.


sorry but u shouldn't need a sports button

Now now....lets not have an R50/R53 & R56 war here :hand: :Whistle:

Both cars are tremendous.....and I'm sure any turbo lag is made up for when it actually kicks in.

But I think we can all agree on which one is the best looking :D :p :moonie:

[zimbo]

But I think we can all agree on which one is the best looking :D :p :moonie:

Yeah the R56 :thumbs up: :p

[Smitty]

Yeah the R56 :thumbs up: :p

There was me trying to make peace and you just had to get me all annoyed :argh: :ragin::p ;)

[Fester]

With the sport button on its very responsive.

Damn I never found the sport button!!!!

I think I've opened a can of worms here but its been good to hear what others think.

[The Dogfather]

Lag? My arse there's lag. The R56 Turbo response is instantaneous, in fact on a recent run round the dales I would often pull away from Steve's R53 JCW initially until his revs built up enough for full power at which point he'd reel in the gap.

To be honest with the advent of variable vane turbo most modern turbo engines don't suffer from lag.

I've driven both the R53S and the R56S and the new engine is superior in everyway excluding the soundtrack, however the Clubbie exhaust on mine does improve the soundtrack compared to the hatch. Add in the better ride, improved build quality and superior seats the R56 is a much better car.

However, I do miss the direct(er) steering on the R50.

[KenL]

Well imho I really dont like the R56...they just look like a Mini thats had an allergic reaction and has swollen up!!! :frown: Should have left the Mini alone after the R53 and the bonnet scoop looks daft since there is a turbo behind it!
The lag is terrible in the S and the car is clumpy, oversized and u.g.l.y to be honest - sorry guys i'll stick with my likkle supercharged beast!

Sour grapes :hand:

[KenL]

Yeah the R56 :thumbs up: :p

I agree 100% ;)

[GCA3N]

mon the R56........oh how times have changed.

Got to say, have not driven the older s but the new one rocks.

[Fairy]

Nah Nah Nah - You want a proper S...go for the supercharged MINI :p

[KenL]

Nah Nah Nah - You want a proper S...go for the supercharged MINI :p

...and what is not proper about a turbo-charged S :hand:

[ELFMAN]

I LOVED my R53 JCW 210 S to bits. It looked great, went like a bat out of hell and sounded like Motorhead at Glasgow Apollo. Reasons for selling were that it was 5 years old and I was about to throw tons of cash at it on more tuning bits which it didn't really need - I really just needed a change, plus the fact MINI were offering a decent discount etc etc.

The R56 S is a more 'sophisticated' car, it has lots of interesting wee touches which address some of the earlier car's shortcomings which shows a bit of thought has gone into it. I probably still prefer the 'leaner' shape of the old car, but I've got used to the newer, slightly 'bloated' appearance, and don't mind it as much - I think it looks fine, especially in Pepper White! The R53 was built with more of a focus on driver appeal, which the new one has maintained, but has adapted for a wider audience. They also couldn't afford to build the old car in the numbers required because it simply cost too much to manufacture, the supercharged S drank petrol like it was going out of fashion (but you forgave it as soon as you red-lined it up through the gears!) and wouldn't have stood up to current emission legislation.

The R56 has TONS of torque from very low revs, which makes it an effortless machine. So the accusation that it's 'Laggy' is pure b*ll*cks. I'm still running it in, so haven't explored beyond 4,500 revs yet, but I can make pretty decent progress even so. The JCW 210 power delivery was fantastic and pulled from low revs to 7,000rpm+ which I loved, but the new one's pretty good as a bog-standard out of the box engine - and I reckon 250BHP would be fairly easy to extract, whether you need it is a different argument.... The STEERING isn't quite for 'feelsome' as my R53, so I'd mark that down in comparison. Rides pretty well considering mine's on Sport Suspension and run-flat 17's - I reckon the suspension setup is similar to the JCW stuff on my old car. I have noticed that my new one has a tendency to 'skip' a bit when confronted with ridges and very uneven surfaces, which I've put down to the Limited Slip Diff and Wheel/Tyre Combo - a bit disconcerting, but only occasional. My old JCW 210 on its 16's would be hard to keep in sight on certain roads....

To sum up my experience so far, the old car probably has the edge for sheer driving pleasure and an unbeatable soundtrack with the proper exhaust/manifold combo, but the new car has the potential to be VERY close. The R56 is certainly a more 'user-friendly' car day to day - for instance, being able to drive quickly without the petrol gauge doing Kamikaze/Stock Market impressions is a bonus, and it feels more sophisticated but still with that MINI fun factor intact. Give it a year or two and I'll have put back a wee bit of that soundtrack and some of that old 'R53 colour' into the Black and White R56.

It's like comparing 'A Farewell to Kings' and 'Snakes and Arrows' by Rush - same group, great albums in their own right, one early, one late, but they both ROCK!

[Crombers]

The Elfmeister speaketh :yes nod:

I'm gonna get ma tickets for the Apollo next Tuesday :thumbs up:

[ELFMAN]

One important thing I forgot to mention - the GEARBOX in the new car is EXCELLENT, and an improvement over my R53 (which was pretty good anyway). But I REALLY miss my FAB JCW Seats (sob!). Think that's everything now.... Where's me Werther's?

CROMBERS - you got the Manifold on yet? Looking forward to hearing it soon - get in there Lemmy!!!!!

[Fairy]

The R56 has TONS of torque from very low revs, which makes it an effortless machine. So the accusation that it's 'Laggy' is pure b*ll*cks.

:lol:Hit a nerve did I?! Jezo calm doon min - I was only giving my opinion which I stick with, even if I won an R56 I would get rid:thud:
Each to their own n all that !

[minimad]

FIGHT, FIGHT,FIGHT :p:ragin::thumbs up:

[ELFMAN]

You didn't hit a nerve at all, and I'm perfectly calm. My own opinion (if you'd read my previous post instead of 'cherry-picking' that one line) is that I reckon the R53 (especially a well-sorted one) is STILL the better drivers car and I still prefer the looks to that of the newer version. So in NO WAY was I 'R53 Bashing'.

I've driven both types - my JCW (which I had for 5 years) started with 160BHP and ended up with roughly 230BHP, so I'm well acquainted with the power deliveries of that engine in various stages of tune. The power delivery on the R56 is 'softer' than the instant 'hit' you get with a tuned R53 (most things are), as the '53's Supercharger has a direct mechanical link to the engine, while all Turbos have to 'spin-up', but unless you're trying to floor it in 5th or 6th from stupidly low revs, the R56 pulls very well indeed - and from my experience is pretty well a match for the older car on the road. So, stating it suffers from 'Turbo-Lag' is, IMHO, incorrect. I certainly don't feel as if I've gone from a Road-Burner to a Bunsen Burner, so the new one must be fairly good... and I haven't even started fiddling around with it - yet.

Neither myself and the NMS folks I know who own R56's, nor any road-testers from 'Evo' magazine or Tiff and Jason on '5th Gear' found it anything other than very responsive and Lag-Free. 'Lag' on these modern Direct-Injected Twin-Scroll small turbo Variable Valve Timing engines just isn't an issue - it's been 'engineered out' as drivers simply won't put up with it like they used to back in the 80's in the quest for power. It's called Progress. Please don't knock it till you've tried it properly. And if you DO win an R56, you can sell it to me for buttons as they're so bad. Ta.

[BigStuff]

I turned 20k miles in my 08 Dooper this morning heres my main observations.

Ride is **** on 17s RFTs
MPG is no where near official in real life. My long term avg is 56mpg
It's built really well. Apart from occasional dash rattle it's been unerringly reliable.
Diesel unit is a little unrefined but gets better with miles.
Engine is really tight new. Takes till after first service to start to loosen up. Per OBC my avg speed in the Dooper is now more than my old BMW 330Ci on same commute.

Would i have another - no it's too tiresome for long communting. An S as a toy in future maybe though.
Is it a bloody good car - Absolutely

[ELFMAN]

I have been referring to the 'S' as opposed to the COOPER D of course. Haven't driven the DOOPER, but most folks seem to like them too.

[euan]

I've very limited experience of an R56, and my feelings on it are well documented, but I'd agree with most of the comments here.

The interior is very nice in the new car (though the flick switches were better in the old car), the engine (in the S I drove) is very strong. The handling didn't feel as direct as the older car, nor was the power delivery (until you hit the sport button).

I still dislike the styling of it - it sits too high at the front end for me. I also dislike the sport button, if they insist on having one, stick it on the steering wheel where it's easier to get at, but really, what's the point? On something like an M5 I can understand it (you don't want 500bhp going to Tescos) but not on a Mini.

I'd probably have one though had it not been for the fact I need a bigger car, though I'd be very torn between it and a Scirocco.

[KenL]

:lol:Hit a nerve did I?! Jezo calm doon min - I was only giving my opinion which I stick with, even if I won an R56 I would get rid:thud:
Each to their own n all that !

Don't you just love the MINI community :rolleyes:

[KenL]

Ride is **** on 17s RFTs


A w*nk is a good thing, surely :hand:

Seriously, I am pretty happy with the ride quality on the R56 Cooper (16" RF standard suspension) I had and the new S (17" runflats).

My wife agrees and says it is much more comfy than the 02 ONE we owned with 15" normal tyres.

[ELFMAN]

I agree with Euan that the 'Sport Button' is a nonsense on the MINI - especially the COOPER and S - surely they should be on 'Sport' mode as standard! It DOES make a difference when engaged, but that's only 'cos the 'Non-Sport' setting is 'flat'! Gimmicks....

[Stewart]

Been paying attention more to the Sport Button on my Cooper. I’ve come to the conclusion that driven right make a difference that’s for sure. My Cooper has a nice wee rip tone from the exhaust on Sport I don’t seem to get with it off.

In truth its only the last few weeks I’ve been using it, but using it on the right Roads. Its probably best off most of the time as I’m quite happy with the way the Cooper accelerates to Tesco etc……

The Mini is probably not far off that BMW I-Drive with a million settings. Friends M5 had more settings than the Space Shuttle….So for now a Wee Button with sport will do me.

[Crombers]

CROMBERS - you got the Manifold on yet? Looking forward to hearing it soon - get in there Lemmy!!!!!

It's going on next week boss, I was waiting for my Oxygen Sensor Signal Compensator to arrive from MiniMania ;)

& off to buy Motorhead CD :cool: :thumbs up:

[BigStuff]

A w*nk is a good thing, surely :hand:

.


Tis' a yoof expression for **** now innit:frown:
Maybe your just too old to understand Ken:yes nod::moonie:

[BigStuff]

Tis' a yoof expression for **** now innit:frown:
Maybe your just too old to understand Ken:yes nod::moonie:

Funny how the filter picks up the s word for crap but misses ****.
I'm a big wain i am :lol:

[Gismo]

Funny how the filter picks up the s word for crap but misses ****Actually, it was in the swear filter but wasn't working, seems ok now though ;)

[ELFMAN]

Is it a 'K&*******N' Swear Filter, or a 'Piper*******cross'? Or is it a ******* 'ITG'?

[X30YES]

You have gone over to the dark side ?? shame on you .;) Somehow I couldnt bring myself to go there ...Whats for some is not for everyone !!!!!!:off topic: