Fifth Gear

[N12 JLK]

Best super mini goes to Fiat 500. how does that work when it does not come out until Jan 2008. :mad:

Who's getting one?

[markyc]

YOU !!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: ;)

[jamesbeaumont]

I was a bit annoyed too but then its a silly programme. Cant argue with them about the R8 though. There was a lovely red one at knockhill on sunday:cool:

[The Dogfather]

The new Fiat is pretty special, we saw a LHD one at the Fiat garage near Newcastle. It does get criticised for it's handling though which means I won't be getting a standard one.

However, if the Abarth version sorts out the handling and has the performance to match the main hot hatches it'll be just a question of where do I sign.

[ianking]

I would like an Abarth one if they do one. In red please. :D

[Ivano]

Check out www.fiat500.com (http://www.fiat500.com)

You can build and spec the car on screen ie colours/wheels/graphics etc

[Maxxed Ross]

I don't like the car, but that car builder program is such a cool idea!

[The Dogfather]

I don't like the car, but that car builder program is such a cool idea!

Fantastic options list......

[FergusM]

I don't like it.... and would be unconvinced about build quality.

[AndyP & Lenore]

I don't like it.... and would be unconvinced about build quality.

Thank goodness. I thought I was the only one who thought it looked a bit pants.:o

And as for build quality - FIAT anyone?:rolleyes: Also, when you drive it off the forecourt you'll hear a loud thump behind the car- that will be your residual dropping off the back.;)

A.:D

[euan]

Thank goodness. I thought I was the only one who thought it looked a bit pants.:o

And as for build quality - FIAT anyone?:rolleyes: Also, when you drive it off the forecourt you'll hear a loud thump behind the car- that will be your residual dropping off the back.;)

A.:D

I'd have thought the thump was the exhaust falling off. ;):D

In saying that, they are getting much better than before on build quality. For the first time in 6 years, some Alfa's and Fiat's are back on our company car list - they were taken off due to build quality. Now, you'd never actually go for one as the C02 is so high your taxed loads on them, but still, a sign of improvement.

The 500 is in such demand the residuals will hold up. People love it, and as such it'll hold it's value, at least for the first 2 years.

I'm tempted...

[ianking]

Come on guys, build quality.........

Are we forgetting how many times the R56's have been in for repairs, recalls, strange noises, rattles, fuel smells, rushing water noises, diesel sounds, rejected cars etc.

Also I think the new 500 will hold its money all right for the first year or so as its going to be the next big thing (so to speak). With all the options available I doubt they will be stock piled either. Stock piling cars really does hit the residuals quite hard.

[Gismo]

Just got round to having a look at the 500, hmm, looks like someone has attached a bicycle pump to a standard Corsa exhaust and blown it up a bit.
As Ian says, given the bad build of some R56 MINI's it's quite ironic that the 500 can be slated for poor build quality already................the car isn't even out in the UK yet :eek: :rolleyes:

The configurator is pretty good, but, could you imagine the cost of all those "extras"

[euan]

Just got round to having a look at the 500, hmm, looks like someone has attached a bicycle pump to a standard Corsa exhaust and blown it up a bit.
As Ian says, given the bad build of some R56 MINI's it's quite ironic that the 500 can be slated for poor build quality already................the car isn't even out in the UK yet :eek: :rolleyes:

The configurator is pretty good, but, could you imagine the cost of all those "extras"

I doubt the extras will cost a lot though - it's not a BMW after all - but it depends how mad you wanted to go. A nicely, individually specced car will add probably no more than 1500 quid to a standard car. Which is probably what most MINI's leave with on them anyway.

[KenL]

Come on guys, build quality.........

Are we forgetting how many times the R56's have been in for repairs, recalls, strange noises, rattles, fuel smells, rushing water noises, diesel sounds, rejected cars etc.



Maybe so, but believe me R50s were a LOT worse ;)

[KenL]

I think the 500 looks good.

But, it IS expensive for a Fiat of that size. I would need to see what the residuals were like before buying one.

If it didn't handle better than a MINI, I would not buy one though. In fact, I won't be buying one.

I expect they will sell loads to begin with, not sure how they will do long term though. Could go the way of the Beetle?

[sav112gla]

Anyone who thinks it’s going to fall apart, what century are you living in….as I’m getting a new car next year I’ve been looking and I have to say all the new cars feel solid. If I wanted a rally bullet proof car Id get a Focus like the new works one on the drive just now. New focus every six months over the last five years and never had one bit of problems . friend bought a new cooper S and as far as he’s concerned it’s a bit of junk and cant wait to get rid of it…..in fact the last car he said he had this much trouble with was his Fiat Mirafiori which was some car speed wise but fell apart.

The config thing is the best i've seen....very nice.

[duncan]

Maybe so, but believe me R50s were a LOT worse ;)

Its funny how you compare a car that was brand new, drawing heavily on Rover influences, in a factory that hadn't built that type, with something that should have been right first time. All the hard work had been done with the R50. :rolleyes:

[KenL]

Its funny how you compare a car that was brand new, drawing heavily on Rover influences, in a factory that hadn't built that type, with something that should have been right first time. All the hard work had been done with the R50. :rolleyes:

The R50 was many years in the making and worked on by two design teams. The R56, apart from the change in looks and basic chassis, is pretty much new throughout.

BMW poured a fortune in time and effort to get the R50 ready for production, but it was far from perfect and a LOT worse than the R56 when first released.

The R56 may have faults but nothing that is affecting almost all cars which was the case with the R50.

1. Threat of exploding fuel tank
2. Cars pulling dangerously to the left
3. Steering columns being replaced several times on some cars.
4. Numerous BC1 problems which caused electrics to go bonkers
5. Loads of niggles; squeaky seats, tailgate and suspension knocks etc. etc.


I am (trying) not to slag the early R50 cars, but am speaking as someone who had a painful experience of the R50 MINI. The R56 is not a bad car with poor build quality on the whole.

[duncan]

The R50 was many years in the making and worked on by two design teams. The R56, apart from the change in looks and basic chassis, is pretty much new throughout.

BMW poured a fortune in time and effort to get the R50 ready for production, but it was far from perfect and a LOT worse than the R56 when first released.

The R56 may have faults but nothing that is affecting almost all cars which was the case with the R50.

1. Threat of exploding fuel tank
2. Cars pulling dangerously to the left
3. Steering columns being replaced several times on some cars.
4. Numerous BC1 problems which caused electrics to go bonkers
5. Loads of niggles; squeaky seats, tailgate and suspension knocks etc. etc.


I am (trying) not to slag the early R50 cars, but am speaking as someone who had a painful experience of the R50 MINI. The R56 is not a bad car with poor build quality on the whole.

As I said though Ken, all the hard work was done with the R50, and yes, there were problems with the model.

Personally, I've had very few on both the 2001 build, and the 2005 build R50s - the BC1 affecting both.

However, the fact that there is as many niggles with the R56 as there is, is quite amazing. It didnt come from a standing start. For a premium small car, it SHOULD be better.

[ianking]

Ken

As I posted in the off topic and banter section, your old R50 in my opinion was a great car. I owned it after you and not a spot of bother. Better than both the R56's that Sarah and I have had. :D

[KenL]

Ken

As I posted in the off topic and banter section, your old R50 in my opinion was a great car. I owned it after you and not a spot of bother. Better than both the R56's that Sarah and I have had. :D

Are you serious, you owned my old car (did I miss that thread)? It was beautifully looked after, wasn't it ;)

1. Did the really annoying boom-banga-bang from the rear even when going over small bumps in the road not drive you nuts? Eastern agreed that this was not right, having several failed attempts to fix it.

2. Did the front plastic panel rattling off the windscreen not make you want to pull your hair out?

3. What about the buzzing from the door panels and just about everywhere else in the car not make you want to set fire to it?

4. Had they fixed the airbag warning light when came on the night before I traded it into Western VW?

[KenL]

However, the fact that there is as many niggles with the R56 as there is, is quite amazing. It didnt come from a standing start. For a premium small car, it SHOULD be better.

I agree that any new car should not have niggles.

But, I would like to know what percentage of R56 MINIs are having problems. I would think no more than any other manufacturer.

Go to any owners forum; VW, Audi, Honda, Toyota etc. are they are littered with threads about owners having problems.

The R56 ain't that bad in comparison with any other higher-end make.

[Gismo]

New focus every six months over the last five years and never had one bit of problems
It scares me to think how much you're losing changing cars every 6 months, unless of course you don't have to pay for them.

I remember when i traded in a 6 month old ST24 i lost £6k from new :eek:

[The Dogfather]

I've had my Vectra (new shape) since April covered over 17k, only problem to date was a slightly rattle heat shield on one of the front brakes. Just needed a screw adjusting.

The Smart had a few things done mainly rattles (very hard suspension) but just before it went they had to replace the clutch at 34k.
The brakes used to stick a bit as well.

The Vectra is better than my 53 plate Cooper but that was better than the Smart.

Both of them could teach the ST24 about depreciation. The Vectra was 24k new, I got it for £12500 6 months old 2k miles. The Brabus was 20k new we got it for £11,500 10 months old with 8k.

[sav112gla]

It scares me to think how much you're losing changing cars every 6 months, unless of course you don't have to pay for them.

I remember when i traded in a 6 month old ST24 i lost £6k from new :eek:

Paying nothing mate it’s on a ford Demo scheme basically because of the high mileage that gets done in the car they use the Data…there is a black box in the car that monitors everything its tiny a bit like an amp.

I have to say the fords are fantastic these days. I would never have driven the old escort or sierra. I remember friends brand new XR3i ( yes that’s going back a bit) had disco lights, every time you pressed the brakes all the lights flashed….Shocking, the sun roof was never right in it as well, the passenger got wet when it rained heavy and the car turned left I think it was………plus the sills rusted like nothing I have ever seen.

[Gismo]

Paying nothing mate it’s on a ford Demo scheme
That'll be why then :) you wouldn't do it if you had to pay for it :eek: or would you :rolleyes:

[sav112gla]

1.9 TDI Ghia Focus. Gets 50+ MPH, very comfortable and best of all it has front windscreen Quick defrost…….Love that, when everyone else is scraping away or heating up there car. Two mins and your gone in the ford……


Other car is a eight year old Honda Civic and had no problems with it only the odd git hitting it in car parks with there dam doors.

[duncan]

I agree that any new car should not have niggles.

But, I would like to know what percentage of R56 MINIs are having problems. I would think no more than any other manufacturer.

Go to any owners forum; VW, Audi, Honda, Toyota etc. are they are littered with threads about owners having problems.

The R56 ain't that bad in comparison with any other higher-end make.

Fair point Ken :)

[The Dogfather]

Funny, I've been on the MX5 forums not many problems with them ;)

[duncan]

Funny, I've been on the MX5 forums not many problems with them ;)

Maybe all those hairsprays and perming lotions have had an effect on all the MX5 drivers.

;) ;)