racing focus Rs's

[T100L]

has anybody had a tussle we them? is there any mods to add on my gp to give them a bit of shake up;)

[illegalhunter]

yes lead in your shoes

[james f]

i hope you mean on private roads but when topgear tested the RS had a massive advangte on a cooper S works on track due to the power out put and its clever front differntial however when they tested it was befoure the cooper S gained LSD (standard spec on the GP) so i would imgaine it would be closer now and on the road the cooper S is said to be better but i would reccomend the following: GTT manifold, stoptech BBK as the jcw barkes aint that good, and a AlTA or GTT induction kit as the jcw airbox still has a poo paper element in and ditch the runflats for some decent rubber

its amzing what a mini can do i drove my mates GTT 265 on track and over took a 911 GT3 and a few westies as well

[T100L]

quote:Originally posted by james f

i hope you mean on private roads but when topgear tested the RS had a massive advangte on a cooper S works on track due to the power out put and its clever front differntial however when they tested it was befoure the cooper S gained LSD (standard spec on the GP) so i would imgaine it would be closer now and on the road the cooper S is said to be better but i would reccomend the following: GTT manifold, stoptech BBK as the jcw barkes aint that good, and a AlTA or GTT induction kit as the jcw airbox still has a poo paper element in and ditch the runflats for some decent rubber

its amzing what a mini can do i drove my mates GTT 265 on track and over took a 911 GT3 and a few westies as well
thats what i like to hear, better start saving for the bits, looks like the mini was a excellent choice:D will no doubt be asking you guys for names & numbers of tuning companies & parts peeps..id never think of racing on the highway:eek::disapprove:;)

[james f]

for the cooper S and form experince and recommendations form a good number of mates GTT is the best bet for cooper S power to date (as far as us forum folk know) not one of their conversions has gone wrong lohen are also very good and i use them all the time for my cooper

http://www.gtt.uk.com/home.asp

www.lohen.co.uk

[The Dogfather]

I would say that when you're only talking fractions of a second between cars the difference comes mainly from the driver. If you have a driver who doesn't care about his own safety (or others if it's on a public road) will be quicker.

I've done a near standing start 10-70 on a dual carriageway against a new shape R32 (better traction than my car) he didn't get anymore than 3-4m in front, soon as we hit 70 I backed off, he carried on to god knows what speed. My Brabus does the 0-62 in 6.9 an R32 does it in 6.5.

[john]

There was a focus RS on the last Cullen run and I was driving Nenahs BBR 's', there was no competition so unless your in a straight line shoot out its down to the size of your knackers!!

I have also owned a GP and its even quicker than the BBR so go get em!!;)

[Gorbash12346]

only thing is that it's extremely cheap to get the frs up to good power levels.. a decat induction kit and a bluefin remap with the decat file generally hits 275bhp total cost about £1000

then add a primary designs manifold and a gt28 turbo with an adjusted bluefin file different downpipe from the likes of piper with some denso iridium plugs thats 360bhp and the bottom end still isn't strained lol total cost £2500ish so long as you have a good condition exchange turbo

[ELFMAN]

“LCW Brakes ain't that good” Really James? I've had my 'S' in both its 175 and 210+bhp incarnations on many 'interesting' roads at 'interesting' speeds with the JCW setup - no probs. Not racing anybody mind...

T100L - If you think you need more power than your 218bhp GP has (with its handling etc) to see off anything, you're taking BIG risks on the road. Road racing's usually decided by who's willing to take the most stupid risks, not necessarily how good you or your car is. A prat with an Astra can be as 'quick' in certain conditions as a good driver in a MINI - if he's prepared to risk his (and everybody else's) life to overtake other traffic etc - as Vidal said. It's a no-brainer. I like to drive quickly, but on my own terms. In the past I've done my fair share of 'racing' on the road in (old) Minis, Novas, 106's etc, but, because of the machinery I had then, at lower speeds than our cars are capable of (apart from my tuned 106GTI), and when the roads were less congested/lumpy than they are now. I've also been bloody lucky a few times. Live and learn. If you want to REALLY enjoy your GP, take it North, up the West Coast roads this Summer!

Gorbash - 360bhp is just b*ll*cks for a road MINI. Anything's possible, obviously, but above 250 is just a recipe for an unbalanced monster on our crappy roads. Playmini's Demo car is TOTALLY sorted in every way and they're putting out 265bhp. If you need 360bhp, buy a 2nd hand Scooby or an Evo and at least you'll get the power down. I know I'm an old fart, but all this huge power “Bench Racing” nonsense is just that. “All mouth and trousers” as they say. You try putting 300+bhp down on a greasy, bumpy, twisty road through FWD and '205' size tyres on a MINI and see how far and how fast you go!

[The Dogfather]

Elfman, I think he was talking about a Focus with 360bhp

[KenL]

quote:Originally posted by Vidal Buffoon

Elfman, I think he was talking about a Focus with 360bhp


Would still be 360bhp through the front wheels, which is nuts.

[Scottie]

listening to folks on the thread I gather that the GP will be as quick or quicker than the Focus. So on that basis just let them pass and think to yourself look at that @rse he has no idea how much quicker I am in my Mini.

When I had my V10 Treg chipped Sometimes going up the A9 I used to let a Supercharged FFRR get close them a quick burst of speed loosing them in my diesel smoke soon got them told. Wolf in sheeps clothing. Slow down let them past with a we wave job done.:cool:

[sedgie]

B*gger moddin!:p if you want a fast car....just go buy a Bugatti Zeyron :p:p:p:D

[james f]

quote:Originally posted by KenL


quote:Originally posted by Vidal Buffoon

Elfman, I think he was talking about a Focus with 360bhp


Would still be 360bhp through the front wheels, which is nuts.


yep ive driven a 265 bhp S GTT with no LSD on track an there was no torque steer :eek:the gretag box on the S copes very well with the power showed a 911 GT3 up :Dmuch to the porker owners annoynace Roland GTT has 280 ish through his front wheels with a qauife LSD and flies round a track MINIs are one of the few FWD cars that can handle real power through the front wheels

[sh@z]

If you owned a 911 GT3 in a mini (even 260bhp) it just shows how incompetent the Porsche driver was :p, another example of how 90% of it is down to the driver.

[james f]

yep and the fact that we were running the S on scrubs too and was my 1st track day none of the m3s could keep up with it either :p

another point of interst that our track adentures gave was having LSD on you S is akin to about 40 bhp the ammount of speed it allows to be carried through the coners is amazing on the mini

[ELFMAN]

NUMPTY ALERT...Sorry Vidal/Gorbash/everybody - NOW I SEE, 'frs' refers to Focus RS - I thought he meant to get the “fu**ers” (sweary word) - meaning GP's - up to good power levels....of course Gorbash wouldn't use such bad language!

Changing to a Turbo DID seem a bit excessive and sounded VERY cheap!!! Some mental MINIS ARE using turbos etc, so I joined the dots and got it wrong... not on the ball obviously. I would say in my defence that since T100L was specifically asking about MINI tuning, I was thrown off by Gorbash's curveball on “how to tune a Focus RS”... Anyway, apart from my misunderstanding, I still stand by what I said Re. masive power outputs etc.

Yes, the MINI is good enough to handle big power (especially if you stick a Quaife LSD in there), but on our roads sometimes less is more - there's only so much traction to be had from a given contact patch on a greasy road, and only so quickly you can physically take a car down a piece of road before it falls off. Track stuff is irrelevant to me, as I'm never going to be on one. You can make a car great for the track, but usually this will compromise its “on road” ability - too low, too stiff etc.

As for the 911 GT3 - from what I've read on that car, and seen at Knockhill (Supercar Track Day last year) the driver in this instance must have been asleep... My mate has a Cayman S, and having been in it on the road, there's NO WAY I'd be having a go at that on road or track. I love my MINI and it goes like the clappers, but “a car's got to know its limitations” as Mr. Eastwood nearly said.

Also, I must be honest, if I wanted a mega-MINI, I wouldn't start with a 22K GP when you can buy a good 2nd hand S for 11 or 12K, tune it, get the suspension, brakes and seating sorted and have all the performance/handling and more for less dosh. AND it'd be more of a 'sleeper' than a GP. As soon as you start hacking about a GP, it could lose its value as a limited edition Works model and fall into the 'just another tuned MINI' category. You have to watch how potential buyers perceive your car when it comes time to sell/trade. From my experience, many BMW Dealers won't touch non-Works tuned motors until you've returned them to standard, and there'll be quite a few pristine unmolested GP's around which will be what folks are looking for.

Sorry again for the initial mix-up! Right I'm away for a lie down....

[james f]

^^ the man is right track and road are as far apart as chalk and cheese MINIs are good liitle cars for the road but unless you commint some serious cash to em they are eaten on track best track mods would be full coilovers, LSD, semi slicks, and stoptech BBK and GTT stut braces then have the engine done you will find that power is easily mateched buy handeling on the roads of this country and having all the handeling sorted is much much much more inmportant than power only once i had coilovers, lsd and a decent set of brakes (stoptech or GTT) and the GTT braces would i think about power

things like the manifold zorst and iinduction without the above is wasted money imo and will only serve as an expensive sound system

until youve run a mini on track you dont know the limits (quite high but lets go in style when it dose) on track bhp is realtivly menaingless its all about 1 the driver 2 how the car is set up 3 the power as with out the 1st 2 the 3rd is usless

[ELFMAN]

Power is Nothing without control - as a big tyre company is wont to say.

While I agree the Manifold & Exhaust don't give huge power gains (I think I got about 15BHP extra on a rolling road test with no other mods and a fairly 'tight' - ie low miles - engine), my car revved really well and sounded the b*ll*cks with just the Playmini gear fitted - as it does now, but with added JCW grunt. I also had a Magnex system on my COOPER, and it made it SO much more fun to drive, bringing out the character of the car, whereas it was too subdued in standard form. So I don't reckon it's wasted money. It's a good way of making your MINI more interesting without whacking up the Insurance with engine mods if you're on a tighter budget.

Totally agree with control BEFORE power. I had my suspension and brakes done way before I went for the JCW engine upgrade. That's what you learn when you've driven a 95bhp 1275 Mini on drum brakes....

[Gorbash12346]

apart from taking it easy in 1st and second a focus rs with that power output is quite useable sure it torque steers but no more than normal

the reason i was saying is that even though there were only 4501 (i think??) built the mods are so cheap and give such good gains that i'd say finding a standard frs is harder than finding one thats got 280+bhp

the reason i was saying this is purely to get the point across don't expect it to be standard because in all likelihood it isn't and believe me even a gp isn't going to manage it if it's much over 250bhp

just my opinion

[ELFMAN]

Point taken Gorbash.

The lesson is - don't go racing on the road guys! A bit of fun's OK, but if it gets serious, you've got two 200+bhp motors screaming up a public road - and it might be your Mum who's coming the other way... food for thought.

[X30YES]

Is not 200-210 bhp,not on the limit for a FWD car anyway guys ...for normal thrashing the car that is ..I did find a big difference going from 175 bhp to my present JCW,it was all over the place, till I knew how and when to apply the power ....now just clocked 10k ,and the wee chap seems to be flying along in the 4-4500 rmp......what a noise as the SS opens up for real !!!...not in the top end but in the lower gears .......<"calls crombers" it's flying now mate, yip even more so.!!!!!
RWD/AWD is a different kettle etc !!!!?????????

[miniman06]

john cooper works do some good tuning stuff. give chris a call at menzies stirling, we aim to give the best prices and outstanding service......
cheers

[james f]

..... GTT do even better stuff driven one of Rolands pices of handy work on track 260 bhp and no torque steer what so ever and handles the wet well too i know why folk get works but for the price its not worth it in my book not when GTT have proven 220 bhp kits for just over 1200

[ELFMAN]

This thread has gone a bit 'off topic' now - apologies to the powers that be!

I've had every car I've owned tuned to some extent (Old Mini - Oselli, then MiniSport (I had horrendous initial problems with my MiniSport engine which caused SO much grief at the time)/Novas - various bits of kit/Peugeot 106's - Hartwell, then L.A.D.). I was of the same opinion as James about the Works gear - ie very pricey per BHP etc. that's why my '01 COOPER only ever got a Magnex system....But why I (and I'm sure a lot of others) have ended up going down the Works road is that
a. Most importantly, the JCW S engine works well (as do the Brakes & Suspension)
b. Ease of fitting/problem solving at your local Dealer (mine's 10 minutes away) - if your tuner is down south etc, and something goes wrong, you're faced with the prospect of lengthy delays/logistics to get it sorted. This has happened to me a couple of times with previous cars)
c. If you're under BMW Warranty, it's shot (subject to argument of what caused what to break) when you touch the engine - I know a few folks who've wished they hadn't gone for 'aftermarket' MINI stuff due to the hassles when it went wrong. I know the good aftermarket gear carries its own warranties, but sometimes it's not that simple to apportion blame. The majority of Works tuned MINIS are under three years old, or the work was done when the car was quite new, so folks ARE concerned with warranties/resale values etc and the JCW is a known quantity. If your car was older and/or you were certain you were keeping it long-term, and especially if you have access to a reputable Speed Shop, that's different, but most folks don't, so if they want to tune, they bite the bullet and go for JCW. My 'JCW Engine' now has a new two year warranty even though my original warranty expired in December.

The petrolhead in me totally agrees with James's argument, and most of these non-BMW conversions are well-proven now, but for the above reasons, some of us decide to keep the 'serious' modifications 'In House'. Prices? You pays your money and makes your choice - I just saved up a bit longer!

[james f]

i totaly see and agree with the above as i suppose i had got used to living very close to GTT and Lohen for the last few years of living in the south and such things as 'regular' mantinance of tuned components is hard esp for us in scotland with no mini tuners close by its a hard call to go for a GTT converison etc (its also why i wont be having things like the pully done on the S when i get it as i wont be close enough to the tuners any more)

im in the frame of mind that i would not pay for the works out right as for the power to cost is to much for me but in my hunt for a second hand S i would get a second hand works as then it becomes better value for money dont get me wrong its a very very good conversion just costs a packet